Discussion:
Trump Wants a 'Pro-American' Education Commission as Critics Respond: 'He's Not Interested in Facts'
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wolfbat359a@mindspring.com
2020-09-19 22:42:51 UTC
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https://www.yahoo.com/entertainment/trump-wants-pro-american-education-191725838.html

President Donald Trump stoked characteristic controversy when he said Thursday he intends to create a commission to promote “pro-American curriculum” in schools instead of what he called "ideological poison."

It was the latest front in Trump's response to so-called "cancel culture," which he has made central to his re-election campaign and to his public appeals after nationwide demonstrations against police misconduct and injustice.

As he has before, on Thursday Trump decried "left-wing mobs" and "Marxist doctrine," and he singled out a widely read history of the country by Howard Zinn and a Pulitzer Prize-winning project by The New York Times that re-examines the role slavery played in America's development.

He also attacked "critical race theory" — which is much more familiar in academia than grade schools.

"We must clear away the twisted web of lies in our schools and classrooms and teach our children the magnificent truth about our country," Trump said at the National Archives Museum in Washington, D.C. "We want our sons and daughters to know that they are the citizens of the most exceptional nation in the history of the world."

Some quickly deemed the announcement “fascist,” while Trump, 74, slammed "toxic" efforts to revisit racism and slavery in U.S. history.

Trump said he plans to sign an executive order creating the “1776 Commission” — a panel he said would “restore patriotic education to our schools" and "encourage our educators to teach our children about the miracle of American history."

“That definitely doesn't sound fascist or anything,” Rep. Don Beyer, a Democratic congressman from Virginia, sarcastically tweeted in response.

Critics of the administration heard in Trump's remarks the authoritarian language of governments who dictate what their citizens can be told.

Former CIA Director Gen. Michael Hayden, who served in the Clinton and Bush administrations from 1999 to 2005, also spoke out.

“Trump wants a patriotic commission, 1776 Commission. What does he know about that? Absolutely nothing,” Hayden tweeted. “And he’s not interested in facts.”

Trump previously tweeted a threat that his administration would withhold funding to California schools who integrated the Times' "1619 Project" into their curricula. (The project has drawn the ire of other conservatives. It has been criticized by some historians and supported by others.) ... (cont)
Johnny
2020-09-19 22:47:59 UTC
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On Sat, 19 Sep 2020 15:42:51 -0700 (PDT)
Post by ***@mindspring.com
President Donald Trump stoked characteristic controversy when he said
Thursday he intends to create a commission to promote “pro-American
curriculum” in schools instead of what he called "ideological poison."
It was the latest front in Trump's response to so-called "cancel
culture," which he has made central to his re-election campaign and
to his public appeals after nationwide demonstrations against police
misconduct and injustice.
As he has before, on Thursday Trump decried "left-wing mobs" and
"Marxist doctrine," and he singled out a widely read history of the
country by Howard Zinn and a Pulitzer Prize-winning project by The
New York Times that re-examines the role slavery played in America's
development.
He also attacked "critical race theory" — which is much more familiar
in academia than grade schools.
"We must clear away the twisted web of lies in our schools and
classrooms and teach our children the magnificent truth about our
country," Trump said at the National Archives Museum in Washington,
D.C. "We want our sons and daughters to know that they are the
citizens of the most exceptional nation in the history of the world."
What's your problem with what he said?
wolfbat359a@mindspring.com
2020-09-19 23:09:24 UTC
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Post by Johnny
On Sat, 19 Sep 2020 15:42:51 -0700 (PDT)
Post by ***@mindspring.com
President Donald Trump stoked characteristic controversy when he said
Thursday he intends to create a commission to promote “pro-American
curriculum” in schools instead of what he called "ideological poison."
It was the latest front in Trump's response to so-called "cancel
culture," which he has made central to his re-election campaign and
to his public appeals after nationwide demonstrations against police
misconduct and injustice.
As he has before, on Thursday Trump decried "left-wing mobs" and
"Marxist doctrine," and he singled out a widely read history of the
country by Howard Zinn and a Pulitzer Prize-winning project by The
New York Times that re-examines the role slavery played in America's
development.
He also attacked "critical race theory" — which is much more familiar
in academia than grade schools.
"We must clear away the twisted web of lies in our schools and
classrooms and teach our children the magnificent truth about our
country," Trump said at the National Archives Museum in Washington,
D.C. "We want our sons and daughters to know that they are the
citizens of the most exceptional nation in the history of the world."
What's your problem with what he said?
Lack of truth. You must like the Soviet way of teaching!
Johnny
2020-09-19 23:33:24 UTC
Reply
Permalink
On Sat, 19 Sep 2020 16:09:24 -0700 (PDT)
Post by ***@mindspring.com
Post by Johnny
On Sat, 19 Sep 2020 15:42:51 -0700 (PDT)
Post by ***@mindspring.com
President Donald Trump stoked characteristic controversy when he
said Thursday he intends to create a commission to promote
“pro-American curriculum” in schools instead of what he called
"ideological poison."
It was the latest front in Trump's response to so-called "cancel
culture," which he has made central to his re-election campaign
and to his public appeals after nationwide demonstrations against
police misconduct and injustice.
As he has before, on Thursday Trump decried "left-wing mobs" and
"Marxist doctrine," and he singled out a widely read history of
the country by Howard Zinn and a Pulitzer Prize-winning project
by The New York Times that re-examines the role slavery played in
America's development.
He also attacked "critical race theory" — which is much more
familiar in academia than grade schools.
"We must clear away the twisted web of lies in our schools and
classrooms and teach our children the magnificent truth about our
country," Trump said at the National Archives Museum in
Washington, D.C. "We want our sons and daughters to know that
they are the citizens of the most exceptional nation in the
history of the world."
What's your problem with what he said?
Lack of truth. You must like the Soviet way of teaching!
What's not true?
wolfbat359a@mindspring.com
2020-09-20 20:35:20 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Johnny
On Sat, 19 Sep 2020 16:09:24 -0700 (PDT)
Post by Johnny
On Sat, 19 Sep 2020 15:42:51 -0700 (PDT)
Post by ***@mindspring.com
President Donald Trump stoked characteristic controversy when he
said Thursday he intends to create a commission to promote
“pro-American curriculum” in schools instead of what he called
"ideological poison."
It was the latest front in Trump's response to so-called "cancel
culture," which he has made central to his re-election campaign
and to his public appeals after nationwide demonstrations against
police misconduct and injustice.
As he has before, on Thursday Trump decried "left-wing mobs" and
"Marxist doctrine," and he singled out a widely read history of
the country by Howard Zinn and a Pulitzer Prize-winning project
by The New York Times that re-examines the role slavery played in
America's development.
He also attacked "critical race theory" — which is much more
familiar in academia than grade schools.
"We must clear away the twisted web of lies in our schools and
classrooms and teach our children the magnificent truth about our
country," Trump said at the National Archives Museum in
Washington, D.C. "We want our sons and daughters to know that
they are the citizens of the most exceptional nation in the
history of the world."
What's your problem with what he said?
Lack of truth. You must like the Soviet way of teaching!
What's not true?
Well let us see! The founding of America involved the Genocide of Indian Tribes. I was never taught this in school.
The Trail of tears was a forced march of Natives in winter to a place out west - Oklahoma I would guess. I was never taught this in school.
From 1846 to 1848, U.S. and Mexican troops fought against one another in the Mexican-American War. Ultimately, it was a battle for land where Mexico was fighting to keep what they thought was their property and the U.S. desired to retain the disputed land of Texas and obtain more of Mexico's northern lands. I was not taught this aspect of the war in school

I think rather then mindless Patriotic Slogans, the children should be taught a balanced reasonable view of history
Johnny
2020-09-20 20:44:58 UTC
Reply
Permalink
On Sun, 20 Sep 2020 13:35:20 -0700 (PDT)
Post by ***@mindspring.com
Post by Johnny
On Sat, 19 Sep 2020 16:09:24 -0700 (PDT)
Post by Johnny
On Sat, 19 Sep 2020 15:42:51 -0700 (PDT)
Post by ***@mindspring.com
President Donald Trump stoked characteristic controversy when
he said Thursday he intends to create a commission to promote
“pro-American curriculum” in schools instead of what he
called "ideological poison."
It was the latest front in Trump's response to so-called
"cancel culture," which he has made central to his
re-election campaign and to his public appeals after
nationwide demonstrations against police misconduct and
injustice.
As he has before, on Thursday Trump decried "left-wing mobs"
and "Marxist doctrine," and he singled out a widely read
history of the country by Howard Zinn and a Pulitzer
Prize-winning project by The New York Times that re-examines
the role slavery played in America's development.
He also attacked "critical race theory" — which is much more
familiar in academia than grade schools.
"We must clear away the twisted web of lies in our schools
and classrooms and teach our children the magnificent truth
about our country," Trump said at the National Archives
Museum in Washington, D.C. "We want our sons and daughters to
know that they are the citizens of the most exceptional
nation in the history of the world."
What's your problem with what he said?
Lack of truth. You must like the Soviet way of teaching!
What's not true?
Well let us see! The founding of America involved the Genocide of
Indian Tribes. I was never taught this in school. The Trail of tears
was a forced march of Natives in winter to a place out west -
Oklahoma I would guess. I was never taught this in school. From 1846
to 1848, U.S. and Mexican troops fought against one another in the
Mexican-American War. Ultimately, it was a battle for land where
Mexico was fighting to keep what they thought was their property and
the U.S. desired to retain the disputed land of Texas and obtain more
of Mexico's northern lands. I was not taught this aspect of the war
in school
I think rather then mindless Patriotic Slogans, the children should
be taught a balanced reasonable view of history
When you are a child you are taught the basics, when you are old
enough to reason and think for yourself you figure out the rest.

We took this country by force from the American Indians and Mexico,
just accept it and get over it, or would you like for all of us to
leave and give it back?
El Castor
2020-09-21 01:20:43 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Johnny
On Sun, 20 Sep 2020 13:35:20 -0700 (PDT)
Post by ***@mindspring.com
Post by Johnny
On Sat, 19 Sep 2020 16:09:24 -0700 (PDT)
Post by Johnny
On Sat, 19 Sep 2020 15:42:51 -0700 (PDT)
Post by ***@mindspring.com
President Donald Trump stoked characteristic controversy when
he said Thursday he intends to create a commission to promote
“pro-American curriculum” in schools instead of what he
called "ideological poison."
It was the latest front in Trump's response to so-called
"cancel culture," which he has made central to his
re-election campaign and to his public appeals after
nationwide demonstrations against police misconduct and
injustice.
As he has before, on Thursday Trump decried "left-wing mobs"
and "Marxist doctrine," and he singled out a widely read
history of the country by Howard Zinn and a Pulitzer
Prize-winning project by The New York Times that re-examines
the role slavery played in America's development.
He also attacked "critical race theory" — which is much more
familiar in academia than grade schools.
"We must clear away the twisted web of lies in our schools
and classrooms and teach our children the magnificent truth
about our country," Trump said at the National Archives
Museum in Washington, D.C. "We want our sons and daughters to
know that they are the citizens of the most exceptional
nation in the history of the world."
What's your problem with what he said?
Lack of truth. You must like the Soviet way of teaching!
What's not true?
Well let us see! The founding of America involved the Genocide of
Indian Tribes. I was never taught this in school. The Trail of tears
was a forced march of Natives in winter to a place out west -
Oklahoma I would guess. I was never taught this in school. From 1846
to 1848, U.S. and Mexican troops fought against one another in the
Mexican-American War. Ultimately, it was a battle for land where
Mexico was fighting to keep what they thought was their property and
the U.S. desired to retain the disputed land of Texas and obtain more
of Mexico's northern lands. I was not taught this aspect of the war
in school
I think rather then mindless Patriotic Slogans, the children should
be taught a balanced reasonable view of history
When you are a child you are taught the basics, when you are old
enough to reason and think for yourself you figure out the rest.
We took this country by force from the American Indians and Mexico,
just accept it and get over it, or would you like for all of us to
leave and give it back?
BTW, who did those American Indians take it from? Everyhing got taken
by somebody from someone. That was the way of the world. Better to
worry about the here and now.
islander
2020-09-22 15:38:43 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by El Castor
Post by Johnny
On Sun, 20 Sep 2020 13:35:20 -0700 (PDT)
Post by ***@mindspring.com
Post by Johnny
On Sat, 19 Sep 2020 16:09:24 -0700 (PDT)
Post by Johnny
On Sat, 19 Sep 2020 15:42:51 -0700 (PDT)
Post by ***@mindspring.com
President Donald Trump stoked characteristic controversy when
he said Thursday he intends to create a commission to promote
“pro-American curriculum” in schools instead of what he
called "ideological poison."
It was the latest front in Trump's response to so-called
"cancel culture," which he has made central to his
re-election campaign and to his public appeals after
nationwide demonstrations against police misconduct and
injustice.
As he has before, on Thursday Trump decried "left-wing mobs"
and "Marxist doctrine," and he singled out a widely read
history of the country by Howard Zinn and a Pulitzer
Prize-winning project by The New York Times that re-examines
the role slavery played in America's development.
He also attacked "critical race theory" — which is much more
familiar in academia than grade schools.
"We must clear away the twisted web of lies in our schools
and classrooms and teach our children the magnificent truth
about our country," Trump said at the National Archives
Museum in Washington, D.C. "We want our sons and daughters to
know that they are the citizens of the most exceptional
nation in the history of the world."
What's your problem with what he said?
Lack of truth. You must like the Soviet way of teaching!
What's not true?
Well let us see! The founding of America involved the Genocide of
Indian Tribes. I was never taught this in school. The Trail of tears
was a forced march of Natives in winter to a place out west -
Oklahoma I would guess. I was never taught this in school. From 1846
to 1848, U.S. and Mexican troops fought against one another in the
Mexican-American War. Ultimately, it was a battle for land where
Mexico was fighting to keep what they thought was their property and
the U.S. desired to retain the disputed land of Texas and obtain more
of Mexico's northern lands. I was not taught this aspect of the war
in school
I think rather then mindless Patriotic Slogans, the children should
be taught a balanced reasonable view of history
When you are a child you are taught the basics, when you are old
enough to reason and think for yourself you figure out the rest.
We took this country by force from the American Indians and Mexico,
just accept it and get over it, or would you like for all of us to
leave and give it back?
BTW, who did those American Indians take it from? Everyhing got taken
by somebody from someone. That was the way of the world. Better to
worry about the here and now.
It is generally understood that there was no native population prior to
the last glacial maximum when migration occurred across the Beringia
land bridge. The American Indians did not take land from anyone.
El Castor
2020-09-22 20:11:01 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by islander
Post by El Castor
Post by Johnny
On Sun, 20 Sep 2020 13:35:20 -0700 (PDT)
Post by ***@mindspring.com
Post by Johnny
On Sat, 19 Sep 2020 16:09:24 -0700 (PDT)
Post by Johnny
On Sat, 19 Sep 2020 15:42:51 -0700 (PDT)
Post by ***@mindspring.com
President Donald Trump stoked characteristic controversy when
he said Thursday he intends to create a commission to promote
“pro-American curriculum” in schools instead of what he
called "ideological poison."
It was the latest front in Trump's response to so-called
"cancel culture," which he has made central to his
re-election campaign and to his public appeals after
nationwide demonstrations against police misconduct and
injustice.
As he has before, on Thursday Trump decried "left-wing mobs"
and "Marxist doctrine," and he singled out a widely read
history of the country by Howard Zinn and a Pulitzer
Prize-winning project by The New York Times that re-examines
the role slavery played in America's development.
He also attacked "critical race theory" — which is much more
familiar in academia than grade schools.
"We must clear away the twisted web of lies in our schools
and classrooms and teach our children the magnificent truth
about our country," Trump said at the National Archives
Museum in Washington, D.C. "We want our sons and daughters to
know that they are the citizens of the most exceptional
nation in the history of the world."
What's your problem with what he said?
Lack of truth. You must like the Soviet way of teaching!
What's not true?
Well let us see! The founding of America involved the Genocide of
Indian Tribes. I was never taught this in school. The Trail of tears
was a forced march of Natives in winter to a place out west -
Oklahoma I would guess. I was never taught this in school. From 1846
to 1848, U.S. and Mexican troops fought against one another in the
Mexican-American War. Ultimately, it was a battle for land where
Mexico was fighting to keep what they thought was their property and
the U.S. desired to retain the disputed land of Texas and obtain more
of Mexico's northern lands. I was not taught this aspect of the war
in school
I think rather then mindless Patriotic Slogans, the children should
be taught a balanced reasonable view of history
When you are a child you are taught the basics, when you are old
enough to reason and think for yourself you figure out the rest.
We took this country by force from the American Indians and Mexico,
just accept it and get over it, or would you like for all of us to
leave and give it back?
BTW, who did those American Indians take it from? Everyhing got taken
by somebody from someone. That was the way of the world. Better to
worry about the here and now.
It is generally understood that there was no native population prior to
the last glacial maximum when migration occurred across the Beringia
land bridge. The American Indians did not take land from anyone.
They took it from each other, and the process was not nice. Look at
the rise and fall of the empires of South America. The native American
population was in a state of constant war -- with each other. Such was
the history of the planet. As I said, we should concern ourselves with
the here and now.
wolfbat359a@mindspring.com
2020-09-22 21:56:54 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by El Castor
Post by islander
Post by El Castor
Post by Johnny
On Sun, 20 Sep 2020 13:35:20 -0700 (PDT)
Post by Johnny
On Sat, 19 Sep 2020 16:09:24 -0700 (PDT)
Post by Johnny
On Sat, 19 Sep 2020 15:42:51 -0700 (PDT)
Post by ***@mindspring.com
President Donald Trump stoked characteristic controversy when
he said Thursday he intends to create a commission to promote
“pro-American curriculum” in schools instead of what he
called "ideological poison."
It was the latest front in Trump's response to so-called
"cancel culture," which he has made central to his
re-election campaign and to his public appeals after
nationwide demonstrations against police misconduct and
injustice.
As he has before, on Thursday Trump decried "left-wing mobs"
and "Marxist doctrine," and he singled out a widely read
history of the country by Howard Zinn and a Pulitzer
Prize-winning project by The New York Times that re-examines
the role slavery played in America's development.
He also attacked "critical race theory" — which is much more
familiar in academia than grade schools.
"We must clear away the twisted web of lies in our schools
and classrooms and teach our children the magnificent truth
about our country," Trump said at the National Archives
Museum in Washington, D.C. "We want our sons and daughters to
know that they are the citizens of the most exceptional
nation in the history of the world."
What's your problem with what he said?
Lack of truth. You must like the Soviet way of teaching!
What's not true?
Well let us see! The founding of America involved the Genocide of
Indian Tribes. I was never taught this in school. The Trail of tears
was a forced march of Natives in winter to a place out west -
Oklahoma I would guess. I was never taught this in school. From 1846
to 1848, U.S. and Mexican troops fought against one another in the
Mexican-American War. Ultimately, it was a battle for land where
Mexico was fighting to keep what they thought was their property and
the U.S. desired to retain the disputed land of Texas and obtain more
of Mexico's northern lands. I was not taught this aspect of the war
in school
I think rather then mindless Patriotic Slogans, the children should
be taught a balanced reasonable view of history
When you are a child you are taught the basics, when you are old
enough to reason and think for yourself you figure out the rest.
We took this country by force from the American Indians and Mexico,
just accept it and get over it, or would you like for all of us to
leave and give it back?
BTW, who did those American Indians take it from? Everyhing got taken
by somebody from someone. That was the way of the world. Better to
worry about the here and now.
It is generally understood that there was no native population prior to
the last glacial maximum when migration occurred across the Beringia
land bridge. The American Indians did not take land from anyone.
They took it from each other, and the process was not nice. Look at
the rise and fall of the empires of South America. The native American
population was in a state of constant war -- with each other. Such was
the history of the planet. As I said, we should concern ourselves with
the here anD NOW
Well many tribes in the west had a honor system. Where the first one to draw blood wins!
wolfbat359a@mindspring.com
2020-09-22 21:59:35 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by El Castor
Post by islander
Post by El Castor
Post by Johnny
On Sun, 20 Sep 2020 13:35:20 -0700 (PDT)
Post by Johnny
On Sat, 19 Sep 2020 16:09:24 -0700 (PDT)
Post by Johnny
On Sat, 19 Sep 2020 15:42:51 -0700 (PDT)
Post by ***@mindspring.com
President Donald Trump stoked characteristic controversy when
he said Thursday he intends to create a commission to promote
“pro-American curriculum” in schools instead of what he
called "ideological poison."
It was the latest front in Trump's response to so-called
"cancel culture," which he has made central to his
re-election campaign and to his public appeals after
nationwide demonstrations against police misconduct and
injustice.
As he has before, on Thursday Trump decried "left-wing mobs"
and "Marxist doctrine," and he singled out a widely read
history of the country by Howard Zinn and a Pulitzer
Prize-winning project by The New York Times that re-examines
the role slavery played in America's development.
He also attacked "critical race theory" — which is much more
familiar in academia than grade schools.
"We must clear away the twisted web of lies in our schools
and classrooms and teach our children the magnificent truth
about our country," Trump said at the National Archives
Museum in Washington, D.C. "We want our sons and daughters to
know that they are the citizens of the most exceptional
nation in the history of the world."
What's your problem with what he said?
Lack of truth. You must like the Soviet way of teaching!
What's not true?
Well let us see! The founding of America involved the Genocide of
Indian Tribes. I was never taught this in school. The Trail of tears
was a forced march of Natives in winter to a place out west -
Oklahoma I would guess. I was never taught this in school. From 1846
to 1848, U.S. and Mexican troops fought against one another in the
Mexican-American War. Ultimately, it was a battle for land where
Mexico was fighting to keep what they thought was their property and
the U.S. desired to retain the disputed land of Texas and obtain more
of Mexico's northern lands. I was not taught this aspect of the war
in school
I think rather then mindless Patriotic Slogans, the children should
be taught a balanced reasonable view of history
When you are a child you are taught the basics, when you are old
enough to reason and think for yourself you figure out the rest.
We took this country by force from the American Indians and Mexico,
just accept it and get over it, or would you like for all of us to
leave and give it back?
BTW, who did those American Indians take it from? Everyhing got taken
by somebody from someone. That was the way of the world. Better to
worry about the here and now.
It is generally understood that there was no native population prior to
the last glacial maximum when migration occurred across the Beringia
land bridge. The American Indians did not take land from anyone.
They took it from each other, and the process was not nice. Look at
the rise and fall of the empires of South America. The native American
population was in a state of constant war -- with each other. Such was
the history of the planet. As I said, we should concern ourselves with
the here and now.
That would be after European contact. How they behaved before is the issue. Obviously land taken by Europeans caused land conflicts among the natgives
islander
2020-09-23 18:56:22 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by El Castor
Post by islander
Post by El Castor
Post by Johnny
On Sun, 20 Sep 2020 13:35:20 -0700 (PDT)
Post by ***@mindspring.com
Post by Johnny
On Sat, 19 Sep 2020 16:09:24 -0700 (PDT)
Post by Johnny
On Sat, 19 Sep 2020 15:42:51 -0700 (PDT)
Post by ***@mindspring.com
President Donald Trump stoked characteristic controversy when
he said Thursday he intends to create a commission to promote
“pro-American curriculum” in schools instead of what he
called "ideological poison."
It was the latest front in Trump's response to so-called
"cancel culture," which he has made central to his
re-election campaign and to his public appeals after
nationwide demonstrations against police misconduct and
injustice.
As he has before, on Thursday Trump decried "left-wing mobs"
and "Marxist doctrine," and he singled out a widely read
history of the country by Howard Zinn and a Pulitzer
Prize-winning project by The New York Times that re-examines
the role slavery played in America's development.
He also attacked "critical race theory" — which is much more
familiar in academia than grade schools.
"We must clear away the twisted web of lies in our schools
and classrooms and teach our children the magnificent truth
about our country," Trump said at the National Archives
Museum in Washington, D.C. "We want our sons and daughters to
know that they are the citizens of the most exceptional
nation in the history of the world."
What's your problem with what he said?
Lack of truth. You must like the Soviet way of teaching!
What's not true?
Well let us see! The founding of America involved the Genocide of
Indian Tribes. I was never taught this in school. The Trail of tears
was a forced march of Natives in winter to a place out west -
Oklahoma I would guess. I was never taught this in school. From 1846
to 1848, U.S. and Mexican troops fought against one another in the
Mexican-American War. Ultimately, it was a battle for land where
Mexico was fighting to keep what they thought was their property and
the U.S. desired to retain the disputed land of Texas and obtain more
of Mexico's northern lands. I was not taught this aspect of the war
in school
I think rather then mindless Patriotic Slogans, the children should
be taught a balanced reasonable view of history
When you are a child you are taught the basics, when you are old
enough to reason and think for yourself you figure out the rest.
We took this country by force from the American Indians and Mexico,
just accept it and get over it, or would you like for all of us to
leave and give it back?
BTW, who did those American Indians take it from? Everyhing got taken
by somebody from someone. That was the way of the world. Better to
worry about the here and now.
It is generally understood that there was no native population prior to
the last glacial maximum when migration occurred across the Beringia
land bridge. The American Indians did not take land from anyone.
They took it from each other, and the process was not nice. Look at
the rise and fall of the empires of South America. The native American
population was in a state of constant war -- with each other. Such was
the history of the planet. As I said, we should concern ourselves with
the here and now.
Thanks for the clarification. So, you are saying that we shouldn't
bother with teaching about the Indian wars, because that is not the here
and now. Are you saying that we should not teach about the Trail of
Tears? How about our Thanksgiving traditional stories about the
Pilgrims inviting the Indians to their Thanksgiving feast? If we are
only concerned with the here and now, perhaps you believe that the
Confederate memorials are meaningless and objections to taking them down
are unfounded because they are not about the here and now? Should we
teach about the United Fruit Company and their abuses in South America?
How about the My Lai massacre?

We learn from history and that includes learning about the bad parts as
well as the good parts, at least if we aspire to be a better nation.
El Castor
2020-09-23 21:10:55 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by islander
Post by El Castor
Post by islander
Post by El Castor
Post by Johnny
On Sun, 20 Sep 2020 13:35:20 -0700 (PDT)
Post by ***@mindspring.com
Post by Johnny
On Sat, 19 Sep 2020 16:09:24 -0700 (PDT)
Post by Johnny
On Sat, 19 Sep 2020 15:42:51 -0700 (PDT)
Post by ***@mindspring.com
President Donald Trump stoked characteristic controversy when
he said Thursday he intends to create a commission to promote
“pro-American curriculum” in schools instead of what he
called "ideological poison."
It was the latest front in Trump's response to so-called
"cancel culture," which he has made central to his
re-election campaign and to his public appeals after
nationwide demonstrations against police misconduct and
injustice.
As he has before, on Thursday Trump decried "left-wing mobs"
and "Marxist doctrine," and he singled out a widely read
history of the country by Howard Zinn and a Pulitzer
Prize-winning project by The New York Times that re-examines
the role slavery played in America's development.
He also attacked "critical race theory" — which is much more
familiar in academia than grade schools.
"We must clear away the twisted web of lies in our schools
and classrooms and teach our children the magnificent truth
about our country," Trump said at the National Archives
Museum in Washington, D.C. "We want our sons and daughters to
know that they are the citizens of the most exceptional
nation in the history of the world."
What's your problem with what he said?
Lack of truth. You must like the Soviet way of teaching!
What's not true?
Well let us see! The founding of America involved the Genocide of
Indian Tribes. I was never taught this in school. The Trail of tears
was a forced march of Natives in winter to a place out west -
Oklahoma I would guess. I was never taught this in school. From 1846
to 1848, U.S. and Mexican troops fought against one another in the
Mexican-American War. Ultimately, it was a battle for land where
Mexico was fighting to keep what they thought was their property and
the U.S. desired to retain the disputed land of Texas and obtain more
of Mexico's northern lands. I was not taught this aspect of the war
in school
I think rather then mindless Patriotic Slogans, the children should
be taught a balanced reasonable view of history
When you are a child you are taught the basics, when you are old
enough to reason and think for yourself you figure out the rest.
We took this country by force from the American Indians and Mexico,
just accept it and get over it, or would you like for all of us to
leave and give it back?
BTW, who did those American Indians take it from? Everyhing got taken
by somebody from someone. That was the way of the world. Better to
worry about the here and now.
It is generally understood that there was no native population prior to
the last glacial maximum when migration occurred across the Beringia
land bridge. The American Indians did not take land from anyone.
They took it from each other, and the process was not nice. Look at
the rise and fall of the empires of South America. The native American
population was in a state of constant war -- with each other. Such was
the history of the planet. As I said, we should concern ourselves with
the here and now.
Thanks for the clarification. So, you are saying that we shouldn't
bother with teaching about the Indian wars, because that is not the here
and now.
No, it's history.
Post by islander
Are you saying that we should not teach about the Trail of
Tears? How about our Thanksgiving traditional stories about the
Pilgrims inviting the Indians to their Thanksgiving feast? If we are
only concerned with the here and now, perhaps you believe that the
Confederate memorials are meaningless and objections to taking them down
are unfounded because they are not about the here and now?
History.
Post by islander
Should we teach about the United Fruit Company and their abuses in South America?
How about the My Lai massacre?
History. The My Lai massacre was one of the reasons I resigned my
commission after my enlistment was up.
Post by islander
We learn from history and that includes learning about the bad parts as
well as the good parts, at least if we aspire to be a better nation.
My problem with the "history" to which you refer is that I suspect it
is being selectively taught, while context and inconvenient facts are
conveniently ignored by educators with a political axe to grind. So
teach history, but do it without an ulterior motive.

For instance, here is an interesting fact. At age 16 Sam Houston ran
away from home to live with the Cherokee for three years. A Cherokee
chief adopted him and he was given the name "Colonneh", Raven in the
Cherokee language. Houston had a good relationship with the Cherokee
for the rest of his life. That fact would be easily overlooked by a
teacher of history with a political axe to grind.

Ever eat a chicken, lamb chop, or hamburger? Some day you may be
regarded as a blood thirsty ignorant killer of sweet innocent animals.
You built a house on Orcas Island. Was that land stolen from the
original inhabitants, the Lummi tribe of the Salish people? Should you
return that stolen land under your house to its rightful owner? Or,
perhaps we should remember the past but deal with the here and now?
islander
2020-09-24 00:34:36 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by El Castor
Post by islander
Post by El Castor
Post by islander
Post by El Castor
Post by Johnny
On Sun, 20 Sep 2020 13:35:20 -0700 (PDT)
Post by ***@mindspring.com
Post by Johnny
On Sat, 19 Sep 2020 16:09:24 -0700 (PDT)
Post by Johnny
On Sat, 19 Sep 2020 15:42:51 -0700 (PDT)
Post by ***@mindspring.com
President Donald Trump stoked characteristic controversy when
he said Thursday he intends to create a commission to promote
“pro-American curriculum” in schools instead of what he
called "ideological poison."
It was the latest front in Trump's response to so-called
"cancel culture," which he has made central to his
re-election campaign and to his public appeals after
nationwide demonstrations against police misconduct and
injustice.
As he has before, on Thursday Trump decried "left-wing mobs"
and "Marxist doctrine," and he singled out a widely read
history of the country by Howard Zinn and a Pulitzer
Prize-winning project by The New York Times that re-examines
the role slavery played in America's development.
He also attacked "critical race theory" — which is much more
familiar in academia than grade schools.
"We must clear away the twisted web of lies in our schools
and classrooms and teach our children the magnificent truth
about our country," Trump said at the National Archives
Museum in Washington, D.C. "We want our sons and daughters to
know that they are the citizens of the most exceptional
nation in the history of the world."
What's your problem with what he said?
Lack of truth. You must like the Soviet way of teaching!
What's not true?
Well let us see! The founding of America involved the Genocide of
Indian Tribes. I was never taught this in school. The Trail of tears
was a forced march of Natives in winter to a place out west -
Oklahoma I would guess. I was never taught this in school. From 1846
to 1848, U.S. and Mexican troops fought against one another in the
Mexican-American War. Ultimately, it was a battle for land where
Mexico was fighting to keep what they thought was their property and
the U.S. desired to retain the disputed land of Texas and obtain more
of Mexico's northern lands. I was not taught this aspect of the war
in school
I think rather then mindless Patriotic Slogans, the children should
be taught a balanced reasonable view of history
When you are a child you are taught the basics, when you are old
enough to reason and think for yourself you figure out the rest.
We took this country by force from the American Indians and Mexico,
just accept it and get over it, or would you like for all of us to
leave and give it back?
BTW, who did those American Indians take it from? Everyhing got taken
by somebody from someone. That was the way of the world. Better to
worry about the here and now.
It is generally understood that there was no native population prior to
the last glacial maximum when migration occurred across the Beringia
land bridge. The American Indians did not take land from anyone.
They took it from each other, and the process was not nice. Look at
the rise and fall of the empires of South America. The native American
population was in a state of constant war -- with each other. Such was
the history of the planet. As I said, we should concern ourselves with
the here and now.
Thanks for the clarification. So, you are saying that we shouldn't
bother with teaching about the Indian wars, because that is not the here
and now.
No, it's history.
Post by islander
Are you saying that we should not teach about the Trail of
Tears? How about our Thanksgiving traditional stories about the
Pilgrims inviting the Indians to their Thanksgiving feast? If we are
only concerned with the here and now, perhaps you believe that the
Confederate memorials are meaningless and objections to taking them down
are unfounded because they are not about the here and now?
History.
Post by islander
Should we teach about the United Fruit Company and their abuses in South America?
How about the My Lai massacre?
History. The My Lai massacre was one of the reasons I resigned my
commission after my enlistment was up.
Post by islander
We learn from history and that includes learning about the bad parts as
well as the good parts, at least if we aspire to be a better nation.
My problem with the "history" to which you refer is that I suspect it
is being selectively taught, while context and inconvenient facts are
conveniently ignored by educators with a political axe to grind. So
teach history, but do it without an ulterior motive.
For instance, here is an interesting fact. At age 16 Sam Houston ran
away from home to live with the Cherokee for three years. A Cherokee
chief adopted him and he was given the name "Colonneh", Raven in the
Cherokee language. Houston had a good relationship with the Cherokee
for the rest of his life. That fact would be easily overlooked by a
teacher of history with a political axe to grind.
Ever eat a chicken, lamb chop, or hamburger? Some day you may be
regarded as a blood thirsty ignorant killer of sweet innocent animals.
You built a house on Orcas Island. Was that land stolen from the
original inhabitants, the Lummi tribe of the Salish people? Should you
return that stolen land under your house to its rightful owner? Or,
perhaps we should remember the past but deal with the here and now?
History has been selectively taught. If you have any delusions that
what Trump is talking about is not selective, especially regarding the
historical influence of slavery on the racism that we suffer today, then
you have been drinking the cool aid. We have a lot to learn from this
history and it is unfortunate that most of that history has been hidden.
Why not teach it, including the context and inconvenient facts without
making it political?

Was the intentional destruction of the Black Wall Street in Tulsa in
1921 by white mobs not history? That was only 100 years ago, but I
never heard about it until recently. Of course, the history courses
that I took in high school and college were taught in the south. Was it
covered in your history courses?
El Castor
2020-09-24 02:44:18 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by islander
Post by El Castor
Post by islander
Post by El Castor
Post by islander
Post by El Castor
Post by Johnny
On Sun, 20 Sep 2020 13:35:20 -0700 (PDT)
Post by ***@mindspring.com
Post by Johnny
On Sat, 19 Sep 2020 16:09:24 -0700 (PDT)
Post by Johnny
On Sat, 19 Sep 2020 15:42:51 -0700 (PDT)
Post by ***@mindspring.com
President Donald Trump stoked characteristic controversy when
he said Thursday he intends to create a commission to promote
“pro-American curriculum” in schools instead of what he
called "ideological poison."
It was the latest front in Trump's response to so-called
"cancel culture," which he has made central to his
re-election campaign and to his public appeals after
nationwide demonstrations against police misconduct and
injustice.
As he has before, on Thursday Trump decried "left-wing mobs"
and "Marxist doctrine," and he singled out a widely read
history of the country by Howard Zinn and a Pulitzer
Prize-winning project by The New York Times that re-examines
the role slavery played in America's development.
He also attacked "critical race theory" — which is much more
familiar in academia than grade schools.
"We must clear away the twisted web of lies in our schools
and classrooms and teach our children the magnificent truth
about our country," Trump said at the National Archives
Museum in Washington, D.C. "We want our sons and daughters to
know that they are the citizens of the most exceptional
nation in the history of the world."
What's your problem with what he said?
Lack of truth. You must like the Soviet way of teaching!
What's not true?
Well let us see! The founding of America involved the Genocide of
Indian Tribes. I was never taught this in school. The Trail of tears
was a forced march of Natives in winter to a place out west -
Oklahoma I would guess. I was never taught this in school. From 1846
to 1848, U.S. and Mexican troops fought against one another in the
Mexican-American War. Ultimately, it was a battle for land where
Mexico was fighting to keep what they thought was their property and
the U.S. desired to retain the disputed land of Texas and obtain more
of Mexico's northern lands. I was not taught this aspect of the war
in school
I think rather then mindless Patriotic Slogans, the children should
be taught a balanced reasonable view of history
When you are a child you are taught the basics, when you are old
enough to reason and think for yourself you figure out the rest.
We took this country by force from the American Indians and Mexico,
just accept it and get over it, or would you like for all of us to
leave and give it back?
BTW, who did those American Indians take it from? Everyhing got taken
by somebody from someone. That was the way of the world. Better to
worry about the here and now.
It is generally understood that there was no native population prior to
the last glacial maximum when migration occurred across the Beringia
land bridge. The American Indians did not take land from anyone.
They took it from each other, and the process was not nice. Look at
the rise and fall of the empires of South America. The native American
population was in a state of constant war -- with each other. Such was
the history of the planet. As I said, we should concern ourselves with
the here and now.
Thanks for the clarification. So, you are saying that we shouldn't
bother with teaching about the Indian wars, because that is not the here
and now.
No, it's history.
Post by islander
Are you saying that we should not teach about the Trail of
Tears? How about our Thanksgiving traditional stories about the
Pilgrims inviting the Indians to their Thanksgiving feast? If we are
only concerned with the here and now, perhaps you believe that the
Confederate memorials are meaningless and objections to taking them down
are unfounded because they are not about the here and now?
History.
Post by islander
Should we teach about the United Fruit Company and their abuses in South America?
How about the My Lai massacre?
History. The My Lai massacre was one of the reasons I resigned my
commission after my enlistment was up.
Post by islander
We learn from history and that includes learning about the bad parts as
well as the good parts, at least if we aspire to be a better nation.
My problem with the "history" to which you refer is that I suspect it
is being selectively taught, while context and inconvenient facts are
conveniently ignored by educators with a political axe to grind. So
teach history, but do it without an ulterior motive.
For instance, here is an interesting fact. At age 16 Sam Houston ran
away from home to live with the Cherokee for three years. A Cherokee
chief adopted him and he was given the name "Colonneh", Raven in the
Cherokee language. Houston had a good relationship with the Cherokee
for the rest of his life. That fact would be easily overlooked by a
teacher of history with a political axe to grind.
Ever eat a chicken, lamb chop, or hamburger? Some day you may be
regarded as a blood thirsty ignorant killer of sweet innocent animals.
You built a house on Orcas Island. Was that land stolen from the
original inhabitants, the Lummi tribe of the Salish people? Should you
return that stolen land under your house to its rightful owner? Or,
perhaps we should remember the past but deal with the here and now?
History has been selectively taught. If you have any delusions that
what Trump is talking about is not selective, especially regarding the
historical influence of slavery on the racism that we suffer today, then
you have been drinking the cool aid. We have a lot to learn from this
history and it is unfortunate that most of that history has been hidden.
Why not teach it, including the context and inconvenient facts without
making it political?
No problem with that ... if it is possible, which I very much doubt.
Post by islander
Was the intentional destruction of the Black Wall Street in Tulsa in
1921 by white mobs not history? That was only 100 years ago, but I
never heard about it until recently. Of course, the history courses
that I took in high school and college were taught in the south. Was it
covered in your history courses?
Nope, at least not that I can recall. Looked it up. Terrible thing,
but to put it into perspective, far more Whites are killed by Blacks
every year than died in that massacre. In fact, in the here and now
far more of every race (probably mostly Black) die every year in
Chicago than died in that massacre. Care to teach those statistics?
That does not excuse what happened in Tulsa, but neither can it be
used to justify crime and murder 100 years later in the here and now.

How about that land your house was built on? Giving it back to the
Lummis?
islander
2020-09-26 00:54:29 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by El Castor
Post by islander
Post by El Castor
Post by islander
Post by El Castor
Post by islander
Post by El Castor
Post by Johnny
On Sun, 20 Sep 2020 13:35:20 -0700 (PDT)
Post by ***@mindspring.com
Post by Johnny
On Sat, 19 Sep 2020 16:09:24 -0700 (PDT)
Post by Johnny
On Sat, 19 Sep 2020 15:42:51 -0700 (PDT)
Post by ***@mindspring.com
President Donald Trump stoked characteristic controversy when
he said Thursday he intends to create a commission to promote
“pro-American curriculum” in schools instead of what he
called "ideological poison."
It was the latest front in Trump's response to so-called
"cancel culture," which he has made central to his
re-election campaign and to his public appeals after
nationwide demonstrations against police misconduct and
injustice.
As he has before, on Thursday Trump decried "left-wing mobs"
and "Marxist doctrine," and he singled out a widely read
history of the country by Howard Zinn and a Pulitzer
Prize-winning project by The New York Times that re-examines
the role slavery played in America's development.
He also attacked "critical race theory" — which is much more
familiar in academia than grade schools.
"We must clear away the twisted web of lies in our schools
and classrooms and teach our children the magnificent truth
about our country," Trump said at the National Archives
Museum in Washington, D.C. "We want our sons and daughters to
know that they are the citizens of the most exceptional
nation in the history of the world."
What's your problem with what he said?
Lack of truth. You must like the Soviet way of teaching!
What's not true?
Well let us see! The founding of America involved the Genocide of
Indian Tribes. I was never taught this in school. The Trail of tears
was a forced march of Natives in winter to a place out west -
Oklahoma I would guess. I was never taught this in school. From 1846
to 1848, U.S. and Mexican troops fought against one another in the
Mexican-American War. Ultimately, it was a battle for land where
Mexico was fighting to keep what they thought was their property and
the U.S. desired to retain the disputed land of Texas and obtain more
of Mexico's northern lands. I was not taught this aspect of the war
in school
I think rather then mindless Patriotic Slogans, the children should
be taught a balanced reasonable view of history
When you are a child you are taught the basics, when you are old
enough to reason and think for yourself you figure out the rest.
We took this country by force from the American Indians and Mexico,
just accept it and get over it, or would you like for all of us to
leave and give it back?
BTW, who did those American Indians take it from? Everyhing got taken
by somebody from someone. That was the way of the world. Better to
worry about the here and now.
It is generally understood that there was no native population prior to
the last glacial maximum when migration occurred across the Beringia
land bridge. The American Indians did not take land from anyone.
They took it from each other, and the process was not nice. Look at
the rise and fall of the empires of South America. The native American
population was in a state of constant war -- with each other. Such was
the history of the planet. As I said, we should concern ourselves with
the here and now.
Thanks for the clarification. So, you are saying that we shouldn't
bother with teaching about the Indian wars, because that is not the here
and now.
No, it's history.
Post by islander
Are you saying that we should not teach about the Trail of
Tears? How about our Thanksgiving traditional stories about the
Pilgrims inviting the Indians to their Thanksgiving feast? If we are
only concerned with the here and now, perhaps you believe that the
Confederate memorials are meaningless and objections to taking them down
are unfounded because they are not about the here and now?
History.
Post by islander
Should we teach about the United Fruit Company and their abuses in South America?
How about the My Lai massacre?
History. The My Lai massacre was one of the reasons I resigned my
commission after my enlistment was up.
Post by islander
We learn from history and that includes learning about the bad parts as
well as the good parts, at least if we aspire to be a better nation.
My problem with the "history" to which you refer is that I suspect it
is being selectively taught, while context and inconvenient facts are
conveniently ignored by educators with a political axe to grind. So
teach history, but do it without an ulterior motive.
For instance, here is an interesting fact. At age 16 Sam Houston ran
away from home to live with the Cherokee for three years. A Cherokee
chief adopted him and he was given the name "Colonneh", Raven in the
Cherokee language. Houston had a good relationship with the Cherokee
for the rest of his life. That fact would be easily overlooked by a
teacher of history with a political axe to grind.
Ever eat a chicken, lamb chop, or hamburger? Some day you may be
regarded as a blood thirsty ignorant killer of sweet innocent animals.
You built a house on Orcas Island. Was that land stolen from the
original inhabitants, the Lummi tribe of the Salish people? Should you
return that stolen land under your house to its rightful owner? Or,
perhaps we should remember the past but deal with the here and now?
History has been selectively taught. If you have any delusions that
what Trump is talking about is not selective, especially regarding the
historical influence of slavery on the racism that we suffer today, then
you have been drinking the cool aid. We have a lot to learn from this
history and it is unfortunate that most of that history has been hidden.
Why not teach it, including the context and inconvenient facts without
making it political?
No problem with that ... if it is possible, which I very much doubt.
Post by islander
Was the intentional destruction of the Black Wall Street in Tulsa in
1921 by white mobs not history? That was only 100 years ago, but I
never heard about it until recently. Of course, the history courses
that I took in high school and college were taught in the south. Was it
covered in your history courses?
Nope, at least not that I can recall. Looked it up. Terrible thing,
but to put it into perspective, far more Whites are killed by Blacks
every year than died in that massacre. In fact, in the here and now
far more of every race (probably mostly Black) die every year in
Chicago than died in that massacre. Care to teach those statistics?
That does not excuse what happened in Tulsa, but neither can it be
used to justify crime and murder 100 years later in the here and now.
The number of people killed in the Greenwood Massacre in 1921 is
estimated to be about 300, all black. We will probably never know the
total deaths. Then there was the white mob that destroyed the town of
Wilmington, NC in 1898. Another victory for white supremacists!

Chicago is more complicated, but there is no equivalence with the
Greenwood Massacre. There were 323 blacks killed over the past 365
days. About 1/4 of them were killed by whites. Sadly, murder is
concentrated in areas of poverty and high crime. The problem in Chicago
is not a massacre of innocents, but a legacy of discrimination over a
long period of time.
El Castor
2020-09-26 08:05:32 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by islander
Post by El Castor
Post by islander
Post by El Castor
Post by islander
Post by El Castor
Post by islander
Post by El Castor
Post by Johnny
On Sun, 20 Sep 2020 13:35:20 -0700 (PDT)
Post by ***@mindspring.com
Post by Johnny
On Sat, 19 Sep 2020 16:09:24 -0700 (PDT)
Post by Johnny
On Sat, 19 Sep 2020 15:42:51 -0700 (PDT)
Post by ***@mindspring.com
President Donald Trump stoked characteristic controversy when
he said Thursday he intends to create a commission to promote
“pro-American curriculum” in schools instead of what he
called "ideological poison."
It was the latest front in Trump's response to so-called
"cancel culture," which he has made central to his
re-election campaign and to his public appeals after
nationwide demonstrations against police misconduct and
injustice.
As he has before, on Thursday Trump decried "left-wing mobs"
and "Marxist doctrine," and he singled out a widely read
history of the country by Howard Zinn and a Pulitzer
Prize-winning project by The New York Times that re-examines
the role slavery played in America's development.
He also attacked "critical race theory" — which is much more
familiar in academia than grade schools.
"We must clear away the twisted web of lies in our schools
and classrooms and teach our children the magnificent truth
about our country," Trump said at the National Archives
Museum in Washington, D.C. "We want our sons and daughters to
know that they are the citizens of the most exceptional
nation in the history of the world."
What's your problem with what he said?
Lack of truth. You must like the Soviet way of teaching!
What's not true?
Well let us see! The founding of America involved the Genocide of
Indian Tribes. I was never taught this in school. The Trail of tears
was a forced march of Natives in winter to a place out west -
Oklahoma I would guess. I was never taught this in school. From 1846
to 1848, U.S. and Mexican troops fought against one another in the
Mexican-American War. Ultimately, it was a battle for land where
Mexico was fighting to keep what they thought was their property and
the U.S. desired to retain the disputed land of Texas and obtain more
of Mexico's northern lands. I was not taught this aspect of the war
in school
I think rather then mindless Patriotic Slogans, the children should
be taught a balanced reasonable view of history
When you are a child you are taught the basics, when you are old
enough to reason and think for yourself you figure out the rest.
We took this country by force from the American Indians and Mexico,
just accept it and get over it, or would you like for all of us to
leave and give it back?
BTW, who did those American Indians take it from? Everyhing got taken
by somebody from someone. That was the way of the world. Better to
worry about the here and now.
It is generally understood that there was no native population prior to
the last glacial maximum when migration occurred across the Beringia
land bridge. The American Indians did not take land from anyone.
They took it from each other, and the process was not nice. Look at
the rise and fall of the empires of South America. The native American
population was in a state of constant war -- with each other. Such was
the history of the planet. As I said, we should concern ourselves with
the here and now.
Thanks for the clarification. So, you are saying that we shouldn't
bother with teaching about the Indian wars, because that is not the here
and now.
No, it's history.
Post by islander
Are you saying that we should not teach about the Trail of
Tears? How about our Thanksgiving traditional stories about the
Pilgrims inviting the Indians to their Thanksgiving feast? If we are
only concerned with the here and now, perhaps you believe that the
Confederate memorials are meaningless and objections to taking them down
are unfounded because they are not about the here and now?
History.
Post by islander
Should we teach about the United Fruit Company and their abuses in South America?
How about the My Lai massacre?
History. The My Lai massacre was one of the reasons I resigned my
commission after my enlistment was up.
Post by islander
We learn from history and that includes learning about the bad parts as
well as the good parts, at least if we aspire to be a better nation.
My problem with the "history" to which you refer is that I suspect it
is being selectively taught, while context and inconvenient facts are
conveniently ignored by educators with a political axe to grind. So
teach history, but do it without an ulterior motive.
For instance, here is an interesting fact. At age 16 Sam Houston ran
away from home to live with the Cherokee for three years. A Cherokee
chief adopted him and he was given the name "Colonneh", Raven in the
Cherokee language. Houston had a good relationship with the Cherokee
for the rest of his life. That fact would be easily overlooked by a
teacher of history with a political axe to grind.
Ever eat a chicken, lamb chop, or hamburger? Some day you may be
regarded as a blood thirsty ignorant killer of sweet innocent animals.
You built a house on Orcas Island. Was that land stolen from the
original inhabitants, the Lummi tribe of the Salish people? Should you
return that stolen land under your house to its rightful owner? Or,
perhaps we should remember the past but deal with the here and now?
History has been selectively taught. If you have any delusions that
what Trump is talking about is not selective, especially regarding the
historical influence of slavery on the racism that we suffer today, then
you have been drinking the cool aid. We have a lot to learn from this
history and it is unfortunate that most of that history has been hidden.
Why not teach it, including the context and inconvenient facts without
making it political?
No problem with that ... if it is possible, which I very much doubt.
Post by islander
Was the intentional destruction of the Black Wall Street in Tulsa in
1921 by white mobs not history? That was only 100 years ago, but I
never heard about it until recently. Of course, the history courses
that I took in high school and college were taught in the south. Was it
covered in your history courses?
Nope, at least not that I can recall. Looked it up. Terrible thing,
but to put it into perspective, far more Whites are killed by Blacks
every year than died in that massacre. In fact, in the here and now
far more of every race (probably mostly Black) die every year in
Chicago than died in that massacre. Care to teach those statistics?
That does not excuse what happened in Tulsa, but neither can it be
used to justify crime and murder 100 years later in the here and now.
The number of people killed in the Greenwood Massacre in 1921 is
estimated to be about 300, all black. We will probably never know the
total deaths. Then there was the white mob that destroyed the town of
Wilmington, NC in 1898. Another victory for white supremacists!
Your examples of White misdeeds would seem more genuine and well
intentioned if they included mention of Black misdeeds -- as in far
more Whites killed by Blacks since that Greenwood Massacre. Are those
murders the act of Black supremacists? In all fairness, no. They are
the act of a race genetically deprived of the same level of
intelligence of competing White and Asian races, but forced by the
crime of slavery to live and compete with those races. Like it or not,
there is a proven inverse relationship between IQ and crime. Not
unexpectedly, US Asians who were the subject of great discrimination
in the past, have higher IQs than US Whites, and significantly lower
crime rates. The undergraduate student body at UC Berkeley is 35.4%
Asian and 2.3% Black. Discrimination -- no, IQ -- yes. BTW, 26.3%
White.
https://www.bing.com/search?q=Demographics+UC+Berkeley&qs=n&form=QBRE&sp=-1&pq=demographics+uc+berkeley&sc=7-24&sk=&cvid=5DFEC139B7994E76806DD71B751284D9
Post by islander
Chicago is more complicated, but there is no equivalence with the
Greenwood Massacre. There were 323 blacks killed over the past 365
days. About 1/4 of them were killed by whites. Sadly, murder is
concentrated in areas of poverty and high crime. The problem in Chicago
is not a massacre of innocents, but a legacy of discrimination over a
long period of time.
More accurately, the legacy of a population forced to exist in an
environment that evolution did not prepare them to inhabit.
islander
2020-09-26 15:13:17 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by El Castor
Post by islander
Post by El Castor
Post by islander
Post by El Castor
Post by islander
Post by El Castor
Post by islander
Post by El Castor
Post by Johnny
On Sun, 20 Sep 2020 13:35:20 -0700 (PDT)
Post by ***@mindspring.com
Post by Johnny
On Sat, 19 Sep 2020 16:09:24 -0700 (PDT)
Post by Johnny
On Sat, 19 Sep 2020 15:42:51 -0700 (PDT)
Post by ***@mindspring.com
President Donald Trump stoked characteristic controversy when
he said Thursday he intends to create a commission to promote
“pro-American curriculum” in schools instead of what he
called "ideological poison."
It was the latest front in Trump's response to so-called
"cancel culture," which he has made central to his
re-election campaign and to his public appeals after
nationwide demonstrations against police misconduct and
injustice.
As he has before, on Thursday Trump decried "left-wing mobs"
and "Marxist doctrine," and he singled out a widely read
history of the country by Howard Zinn and a Pulitzer
Prize-winning project by The New York Times that re-examines
the role slavery played in America's development.
He also attacked "critical race theory" — which is much more
familiar in academia than grade schools.
"We must clear away the twisted web of lies in our schools
and classrooms and teach our children the magnificent truth
about our country," Trump said at the National Archives
Museum in Washington, D.C. "We want our sons and daughters to
know that they are the citizens of the most exceptional
nation in the history of the world."
What's your problem with what he said?
Lack of truth. You must like the Soviet way of teaching!
What's not true?
Well let us see! The founding of America involved the Genocide of
Indian Tribes. I was never taught this in school. The Trail of tears
was a forced march of Natives in winter to a place out west -
Oklahoma I would guess. I was never taught this in school. From 1846
to 1848, U.S. and Mexican troops fought against one another in the
Mexican-American War. Ultimately, it was a battle for land where
Mexico was fighting to keep what they thought was their property and
the U.S. desired to retain the disputed land of Texas and obtain more
of Mexico's northern lands. I was not taught this aspect of the war
in school
I think rather then mindless Patriotic Slogans, the children should
be taught a balanced reasonable view of history
When you are a child you are taught the basics, when you are old
enough to reason and think for yourself you figure out the rest.
We took this country by force from the American Indians and Mexico,
just accept it and get over it, or would you like for all of us to
leave and give it back?
BTW, who did those American Indians take it from? Everyhing got taken
by somebody from someone. That was the way of the world. Better to
worry about the here and now.
It is generally understood that there was no native population prior to
the last glacial maximum when migration occurred across the Beringia
land bridge. The American Indians did not take land from anyone.
They took it from each other, and the process was not nice. Look at
the rise and fall of the empires of South America. The native American
population was in a state of constant war -- with each other. Such was
the history of the planet. As I said, we should concern ourselves with
the here and now.
Thanks for the clarification. So, you are saying that we shouldn't
bother with teaching about the Indian wars, because that is not the here
and now.
No, it's history.
Post by islander
Are you saying that we should not teach about the Trail of
Tears? How about our Thanksgiving traditional stories about the
Pilgrims inviting the Indians to their Thanksgiving feast? If we are
only concerned with the here and now, perhaps you believe that the
Confederate memorials are meaningless and objections to taking them down
are unfounded because they are not about the here and now?
History.
Post by islander
Should we teach about the United Fruit Company and their abuses in South America?
How about the My Lai massacre?
History. The My Lai massacre was one of the reasons I resigned my
commission after my enlistment was up.
Post by islander
We learn from history and that includes learning about the bad parts as
well as the good parts, at least if we aspire to be a better nation.
My problem with the "history" to which you refer is that I suspect it
is being selectively taught, while context and inconvenient facts are
conveniently ignored by educators with a political axe to grind. So
teach history, but do it without an ulterior motive.
For instance, here is an interesting fact. At age 16 Sam Houston ran
away from home to live with the Cherokee for three years. A Cherokee
chief adopted him and he was given the name "Colonneh", Raven in the
Cherokee language. Houston had a good relationship with the Cherokee
for the rest of his life. That fact would be easily overlooked by a
teacher of history with a political axe to grind.
Ever eat a chicken, lamb chop, or hamburger? Some day you may be
regarded as a blood thirsty ignorant killer of sweet innocent animals.
You built a house on Orcas Island. Was that land stolen from the
original inhabitants, the Lummi tribe of the Salish people? Should you
return that stolen land under your house to its rightful owner? Or,
perhaps we should remember the past but deal with the here and now?
History has been selectively taught. If you have any delusions that
what Trump is talking about is not selective, especially regarding the
historical influence of slavery on the racism that we suffer today, then
you have been drinking the cool aid. We have a lot to learn from this
history and it is unfortunate that most of that history has been hidden.
Why not teach it, including the context and inconvenient facts without
making it political?
No problem with that ... if it is possible, which I very much doubt.
Post by islander
Was the intentional destruction of the Black Wall Street in Tulsa in
1921 by white mobs not history? That was only 100 years ago, but I
never heard about it until recently. Of course, the history courses
that I took in high school and college were taught in the south. Was it
covered in your history courses?
Nope, at least not that I can recall. Looked it up. Terrible thing,
but to put it into perspective, far more Whites are killed by Blacks
every year than died in that massacre. In fact, in the here and now
far more of every race (probably mostly Black) die every year in
Chicago than died in that massacre. Care to teach those statistics?
That does not excuse what happened in Tulsa, but neither can it be
used to justify crime and murder 100 years later in the here and now.
The number of people killed in the Greenwood Massacre in 1921 is
estimated to be about 300, all black. We will probably never know the
total deaths. Then there was the white mob that destroyed the town of
Wilmington, NC in 1898. Another victory for white supremacists!
Your examples of White misdeeds would seem more genuine and well
intentioned if they included mention of Black misdeeds -- as in far
more Whites killed by Blacks since that Greenwood Massacre. Are those
murders the act of Black supremacists? In all fairness, no. They are
the act of a race genetically deprived of the same level of
intelligence of competing White and Asian races, but forced by the
crime of slavery to live and compete with those races. Like it or not,
there is a proven inverse relationship between IQ and crime. Not
unexpectedly, US Asians who were the subject of great discrimination
in the past, have higher IQs than US Whites, and significantly lower
crime rates. The undergraduate student body at UC Berkeley is 35.4%
Asian and 2.3% Black. Discrimination -- no, IQ -- yes. BTW, 26.3%
White.
https://www.bing.com/search?q=Demographics+UC+Berkeley&qs=n&form=QBRE&sp=-1&pq=demographics+uc+berkeley&sc=7-24&sk=&cvid=5DFEC139B7994E76806DD71B751284D9
Post by islander
Chicago is more complicated, but there is no equivalence with the
Greenwood Massacre. There were 323 blacks killed over the past 365
days. About 1/4 of them were killed by whites. Sadly, murder is
concentrated in areas of poverty and high crime. The problem in Chicago
is not a massacre of innocents, but a legacy of discrimination over a
long period of time.
More accurately, the legacy of a population forced to exist in an
environment that evolution did not prepare them to inhabit.
I am very familiar with your argument relating to assertions of lower IQ
among blacks. You should also, by now, be familiar with my arguments as
to cause. Evidence is growing that many aspects of how well an
individual is prepared to function throughout their life is a product of
what happens during gestation. And, that is supported by evidence from
around the world.

I've also said it before many times in this forum and I will repeat it
once again for emphasis. Your justification for your argument is too
convenient in that you are attempting to justify your discrimination
with a flawed argument that genetics is immutable. I obviously disagree
and hold a more optimistic view.

If we are fortunate, we will see a resolution of this argument within
what is left of our lifetimes. In the interim, I choose a more more
optimistic approach to resolving problems of discrimination.
El Castor
2020-09-26 21:14:12 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by islander
Post by El Castor
Post by islander
Post by El Castor
Post by islander
Post by El Castor
Post by islander
Post by El Castor
Post by islander
Post by El Castor
Post by Johnny
On Sun, 20 Sep 2020 13:35:20 -0700 (PDT)
Post by ***@mindspring.com
Post by Johnny
On Sat, 19 Sep 2020 16:09:24 -0700 (PDT)
On Saturday, September 19, 2020 at 4:48:02 PM UTC-6, Johnny
Post by Johnny
On Sat, 19 Sep 2020 15:42:51 -0700 (PDT)
Post by ***@mindspring.com
President Donald Trump stoked characteristic controversy when
he said Thursday he intends to create a commission to promote
“pro-American curriculum” in schools instead of what he
called "ideological poison."
It was the latest front in Trump's response to so-called
"cancel culture," which he has made central to his
re-election campaign and to his public appeals after
nationwide demonstrations against police misconduct and
injustice.
As he has before, on Thursday Trump decried "left-wing mobs"
and "Marxist doctrine," and he singled out a widely read
history of the country by Howard Zinn and a Pulitzer
Prize-winning project by The New York Times that re-examines
the role slavery played in America's development.
He also attacked "critical race theory" — which is much more
familiar in academia than grade schools.
"We must clear away the twisted web of lies in our schools
and classrooms and teach our children the magnificent truth
about our country," Trump said at the National Archives
Museum in Washington, D.C. "We want our sons and daughters to
know that they are the citizens of the most exceptional
nation in the history of the world."
What's your problem with what he said?
Lack of truth. You must like the Soviet way of teaching!
What's not true?
Well let us see! The founding of America involved the Genocide of
Indian Tribes. I was never taught this in school. The Trail of tears
was a forced march of Natives in winter to a place out west -
Oklahoma I would guess. I was never taught this in school. From 1846
to 1848, U.S. and Mexican troops fought against one another in the
Mexican-American War. Ultimately, it was a battle for land where
Mexico was fighting to keep what they thought was their property and
the U.S. desired to retain the disputed land of Texas and obtain more
of Mexico's northern lands. I was not taught this aspect of the war
in school
I think rather then mindless Patriotic Slogans, the children should
be taught a balanced reasonable view of history
When you are a child you are taught the basics, when you are old
enough to reason and think for yourself you figure out the rest.
We took this country by force from the American Indians and Mexico,
just accept it and get over it, or would you like for all of us to
leave and give it back?
BTW, who did those American Indians take it from? Everyhing got taken
by somebody from someone. That was the way of the world. Better to
worry about the here and now.
It is generally understood that there was no native population prior to
the last glacial maximum when migration occurred across the Beringia
land bridge. The American Indians did not take land from anyone.
They took it from each other, and the process was not nice. Look at
the rise and fall of the empires of South America. The native American
population was in a state of constant war -- with each other. Such was
the history of the planet. As I said, we should concern ourselves with
the here and now.
Thanks for the clarification. So, you are saying that we shouldn't
bother with teaching about the Indian wars, because that is not the here
and now.
No, it's history.
Post by islander
Are you saying that we should not teach about the Trail of
Tears? How about our Thanksgiving traditional stories about the
Pilgrims inviting the Indians to their Thanksgiving feast? If we are
only concerned with the here and now, perhaps you believe that the
Confederate memorials are meaningless and objections to taking them down
are unfounded because they are not about the here and now?
History.
Post by islander
Should we teach about the United Fruit Company and their abuses in South America?
How about the My Lai massacre?
History. The My Lai massacre was one of the reasons I resigned my
commission after my enlistment was up.
Post by islander
We learn from history and that includes learning about the bad parts as
well as the good parts, at least if we aspire to be a better nation.
My problem with the "history" to which you refer is that I suspect it
is being selectively taught, while context and inconvenient facts are
conveniently ignored by educators with a political axe to grind. So
teach history, but do it without an ulterior motive.
For instance, here is an interesting fact. At age 16 Sam Houston ran
away from home to live with the Cherokee for three years. A Cherokee
chief adopted him and he was given the name "Colonneh", Raven in the
Cherokee language. Houston had a good relationship with the Cherokee
for the rest of his life. That fact would be easily overlooked by a
teacher of history with a political axe to grind.
Ever eat a chicken, lamb chop, or hamburger? Some day you may be
regarded as a blood thirsty ignorant killer of sweet innocent animals.
You built a house on Orcas Island. Was that land stolen from the
original inhabitants, the Lummi tribe of the Salish people? Should you
return that stolen land under your house to its rightful owner? Or,
perhaps we should remember the past but deal with the here and now?
History has been selectively taught. If you have any delusions that
what Trump is talking about is not selective, especially regarding the
historical influence of slavery on the racism that we suffer today, then
you have been drinking the cool aid. We have a lot to learn from this
history and it is unfortunate that most of that history has been hidden.
Why not teach it, including the context and inconvenient facts without
making it political?
No problem with that ... if it is possible, which I very much doubt.
Post by islander
Was the intentional destruction of the Black Wall Street in Tulsa in
1921 by white mobs not history? That was only 100 years ago, but I
never heard about it until recently. Of course, the history courses
that I took in high school and college were taught in the south. Was it
covered in your history courses?
Nope, at least not that I can recall. Looked it up. Terrible thing,
but to put it into perspective, far more Whites are killed by Blacks
every year than died in that massacre. In fact, in the here and now
far more of every race (probably mostly Black) die every year in
Chicago than died in that massacre. Care to teach those statistics?
That does not excuse what happened in Tulsa, but neither can it be
used to justify crime and murder 100 years later in the here and now.
The number of people killed in the Greenwood Massacre in 1921 is
estimated to be about 300, all black. We will probably never know the
total deaths. Then there was the white mob that destroyed the town of
Wilmington, NC in 1898. Another victory for white supremacists!
Your examples of White misdeeds would seem more genuine and well
intentioned if they included mention of Black misdeeds -- as in far
more Whites killed by Blacks since that Greenwood Massacre. Are those
murders the act of Black supremacists? In all fairness, no. They are
the act of a race genetically deprived of the same level of
intelligence of competing White and Asian races, but forced by the
crime of slavery to live and compete with those races. Like it or not,
there is a proven inverse relationship between IQ and crime. Not
unexpectedly, US Asians who were the subject of great discrimination
in the past, have higher IQs than US Whites, and significantly lower
crime rates. The undergraduate student body at UC Berkeley is 35.4%
Asian and 2.3% Black. Discrimination -- no, IQ -- yes. BTW, 26.3%
White.
https://www.bing.com/search?q=Demographics+UC+Berkeley&qs=n&form=QBRE&sp=-1&pq=demographics+uc+berkeley&sc=7-24&sk=&cvid=5DFEC139B7994E76806DD71B751284D9
Post by islander
Chicago is more complicated, but there is no equivalence with the
Greenwood Massacre. There were 323 blacks killed over the past 365
days. About 1/4 of them were killed by whites. Sadly, murder is
concentrated in areas of poverty and high crime. The problem in Chicago
is not a massacre of innocents, but a legacy of discrimination over a
long period of time.
More accurately, the legacy of a population forced to exist in an
environment that evolution did not prepare them to inhabit.
I am very familiar with your argument relating to assertions of lower IQ
among blacks. You should also, by now, be familiar with my arguments as
to cause. Evidence is growing that many aspects of how well an
individual is prepared to function throughout their life is a product of
what happens during gestation. And, that is supported by evidence from
around the world.
As soon as you determine the exact nature of the environmental origin
of Ashkenazi and East Asian intelligence please share it with us and
the rest of the world. Forgive me if I don't hold my breath. In the
meantime, 85 median Black IQ.
Post by islander
I've also said it before many times in this forum and I will repeat it
once again for emphasis. Your justification for your argument is too
convenient in that you are attempting to justify your discrimination
with a flawed argument that genetics is immutable. I obviously disagree
and hold a more optimistic view.
You hold a very convenient and entirely political view.
Post by islander
If we are fortunate, we will see a resolution of this argument within
what is left of our lifetimes. In the interim, I choose a more more
optimistic approach to resolving problems of discrimination.
I also would choose a more optimistic, and dare I say, realistic
approach.

1. Quit importing immigrant Latino labor -- labor that fill jobs that
might be filled by African Americans, as well as others.

2. Retrieve manufacturing jobs from Asia -- jobs that could be filled
by African Americans, as well as others.

3. Devote legislative brain power to laws and a welfare system that
encourages, rather than discourages, two parent welfare recipient
families.

4. Continue, and expand, Trump's opportunity zones.

5. Quit punishing, and instead encourage, research on IQ and
techniques of genetic enhancement of IQ and other desirable
attributes, as well as elimination of genetic disorders and disease.
Oh, and by all means, throw in your gestation research

I would be most pleased to see my taxes raised to pay for all of the
above. Would you?
islander
2020-09-27 16:27:16 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by El Castor
Post by islander
Post by El Castor
Post by islander
Post by El Castor
Post by islander
Post by El Castor
Post by islander
Post by El Castor
Post by islander
Post by El Castor
Post by Johnny
On Sun, 20 Sep 2020 13:35:20 -0700 (PDT)
Post by ***@mindspring.com
Post by Johnny
On Sat, 19 Sep 2020 16:09:24 -0700 (PDT)
On Saturday, September 19, 2020 at 4:48:02 PM UTC-6, Johnny
Post by Johnny
On Sat, 19 Sep 2020 15:42:51 -0700 (PDT)
Post by ***@mindspring.com
President Donald Trump stoked characteristic controversy when
he said Thursday he intends to create a commission to promote
“pro-American curriculum” in schools instead of what he
called "ideological poison."
It was the latest front in Trump's response to so-called
"cancel culture," which he has made central to his
re-election campaign and to his public appeals after
nationwide demonstrations against police misconduct and
injustice.
As he has before, on Thursday Trump decried "left-wing mobs"
and "Marxist doctrine," and he singled out a widely read
history of the country by Howard Zinn and a Pulitzer
Prize-winning project by The New York Times that re-examines
the role slavery played in America's development.
He also attacked "critical race theory" — which is much more
familiar in academia than grade schools.
"We must clear away the twisted web of lies in our schools
and classrooms and teach our children the magnificent truth
about our country," Trump said at the National Archives
Museum in Washington, D.C. "We want our sons and daughters to
know that they are the citizens of the most exceptional
nation in the history of the world."
What's your problem with what he said?
Lack of truth. You must like the Soviet way of teaching!
What's not true?
Well let us see! The founding of America involved the Genocide of
Indian Tribes. I was never taught this in school. The Trail of tears
was a forced march of Natives in winter to a place out west -
Oklahoma I would guess. I was never taught this in school. From 1846
to 1848, U.S. and Mexican troops fought against one another in the
Mexican-American War. Ultimately, it was a battle for land where
Mexico was fighting to keep what they thought was their property and
the U.S. desired to retain the disputed land of Texas and obtain more
of Mexico's northern lands. I was not taught this aspect of the war
in school
I think rather then mindless Patriotic Slogans, the children should
be taught a balanced reasonable view of history
When you are a child you are taught the basics, when you are old
enough to reason and think for yourself you figure out the rest.
We took this country by force from the American Indians and Mexico,
just accept it and get over it, or would you like for all of us to
leave and give it back?
BTW, who did those American Indians take it from? Everyhing got taken
by somebody from someone. That was the way of the world. Better to
worry about the here and now.
It is generally understood that there was no native population prior to
the last glacial maximum when migration occurred across the Beringia
land bridge. The American Indians did not take land from anyone.
They took it from each other, and the process was not nice. Look at
the rise and fall of the empires of South America. The native American
population was in a state of constant war -- with each other. Such was
the history of the planet. As I said, we should concern ourselves with
the here and now.
Thanks for the clarification. So, you are saying that we shouldn't
bother with teaching about the Indian wars, because that is not the here
and now.
No, it's history.
Post by islander
Are you saying that we should not teach about the Trail of
Tears? How about our Thanksgiving traditional stories about the
Pilgrims inviting the Indians to their Thanksgiving feast? If we are
only concerned with the here and now, perhaps you believe that the
Confederate memorials are meaningless and objections to taking them down
are unfounded because they are not about the here and now?
History.
Post by islander
Should we teach about the United Fruit Company and their abuses in South America?
How about the My Lai massacre?
History. The My Lai massacre was one of the reasons I resigned my
commission after my enlistment was up.
Post by islander
We learn from history and that includes learning about the bad parts as
well as the good parts, at least if we aspire to be a better nation.
My problem with the "history" to which you refer is that I suspect it
is being selectively taught, while context and inconvenient facts are
conveniently ignored by educators with a political axe to grind. So
teach history, but do it without an ulterior motive.
For instance, here is an interesting fact. At age 16 Sam Houston ran
away from home to live with the Cherokee for three years. A Cherokee
chief adopted him and he was given the name "Colonneh", Raven in the
Cherokee language. Houston had a good relationship with the Cherokee
for the rest of his life. That fact would be easily overlooked by a
teacher of history with a political axe to grind.
Ever eat a chicken, lamb chop, or hamburger? Some day you may be
regarded as a blood thirsty ignorant killer of sweet innocent animals.
You built a house on Orcas Island. Was that land stolen from the
original inhabitants, the Lummi tribe of the Salish people? Should you
return that stolen land under your house to its rightful owner? Or,
perhaps we should remember the past but deal with the here and now?
History has been selectively taught. If you have any delusions that
what Trump is talking about is not selective, especially regarding the
historical influence of slavery on the racism that we suffer today, then
you have been drinking the cool aid. We have a lot to learn from this
history and it is unfortunate that most of that history has been hidden.
Why not teach it, including the context and inconvenient facts without
making it political?
No problem with that ... if it is possible, which I very much doubt.
Post by islander
Was the intentional destruction of the Black Wall Street in Tulsa in
1921 by white mobs not history? That was only 100 years ago, but I
never heard about it until recently. Of course, the history courses
that I took in high school and college were taught in the south. Was it
covered in your history courses?
Nope, at least not that I can recall. Looked it up. Terrible thing,
but to put it into perspective, far more Whites are killed by Blacks
every year than died in that massacre. In fact, in the here and now
far more of every race (probably mostly Black) die every year in
Chicago than died in that massacre. Care to teach those statistics?
That does not excuse what happened in Tulsa, but neither can it be
used to justify crime and murder 100 years later in the here and now.
The number of people killed in the Greenwood Massacre in 1921 is
estimated to be about 300, all black. We will probably never know the
total deaths. Then there was the white mob that destroyed the town of
Wilmington, NC in 1898. Another victory for white supremacists!
Your examples of White misdeeds would seem more genuine and well
intentioned if they included mention of Black misdeeds -- as in far
more Whites killed by Blacks since that Greenwood Massacre. Are those
murders the act of Black supremacists? In all fairness, no. They are
the act of a race genetically deprived of the same level of
intelligence of competing White and Asian races, but forced by the
crime of slavery to live and compete with those races. Like it or not,
there is a proven inverse relationship between IQ and crime. Not
unexpectedly, US Asians who were the subject of great discrimination
in the past, have higher IQs than US Whites, and significantly lower
crime rates. The undergraduate student body at UC Berkeley is 35.4%
Asian and 2.3% Black. Discrimination -- no, IQ -- yes. BTW, 26.3%
White.
https://www.bing.com/search?q=Demographics+UC+Berkeley&qs=n&form=QBRE&sp=-1&pq=demographics+uc+berkeley&sc=7-24&sk=&cvid=5DFEC139B7994E76806DD71B751284D9
Post by islander
Chicago is more complicated, but there is no equivalence with the
Greenwood Massacre. There were 323 blacks killed over the past 365
days. About 1/4 of them were killed by whites. Sadly, murder is
concentrated in areas of poverty and high crime. The problem in Chicago
is not a massacre of innocents, but a legacy of discrimination over a
long period of time.
More accurately, the legacy of a population forced to exist in an
environment that evolution did not prepare them to inhabit.
I am very familiar with your argument relating to assertions of lower IQ
among blacks. You should also, by now, be familiar with my arguments as
to cause. Evidence is growing that many aspects of how well an
individual is prepared to function throughout their life is a product of
what happens during gestation. And, that is supported by evidence from
around the world.
As soon as you determine the exact nature of the environmental origin
of Ashkenazi and East Asian intelligence please share it with us and
the rest of the world. Forgive me if I don't hold my breath. In the
meantime, 85 median Black IQ.
Post by islander
I've also said it before many times in this forum and I will repeat it
once again for emphasis. Your justification for your argument is too
convenient in that you are attempting to justify your discrimination
with a flawed argument that genetics is immutable. I obviously disagree
and hold a more optimistic view.
You hold a very convenient and entirely political view.
Post by islander
If we are fortunate, we will see a resolution of this argument within
what is left of our lifetimes. In the interim, I choose a more more
optimistic approach to resolving problems of discrimination.
I also would choose a more optimistic, and dare I say, realistic
approach.
1. Quit importing immigrant Latino labor -- labor that fill jobs that
might be filled by African Americans, as well as others.
2. Retrieve manufacturing jobs from Asia -- jobs that could be filled
by African Americans, as well as others.
3. Devote legislative brain power to laws and a welfare system that
encourages, rather than discourages, two parent welfare recipient
families.
4. Continue, and expand, Trump's opportunity zones.
5. Quit punishing, and instead encourage, research on IQ and
techniques of genetic enhancement of IQ and other desirable
attributes, as well as elimination of genetic disorders and disease.
Oh, and by all means, throw in your gestation research
I would be most pleased to see my taxes raised to pay for all of the
above. Would you?
1. No. Latino labor is not the problem. In any case, I thought that
Mexico was going to pay for the wall!

2. No. I find this condescending and racist.

3. No. That is a fig leaf intended to discourage public assistance for
single parents. No one should be enslaved in an abusive relationship.

4. Yes, opportunity zones have a long successful history, but cannot
seem to succeed in providing essential services in areas of poverty.
Food deserts are a failure of opportunity zones.

5. Yes, but it is the religious right that opposes genetic manipulation
in humans.
El Castor
2020-09-27 18:37:38 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by islander
Post by El Castor
Post by islander
Post by El Castor
Post by islander
Post by El Castor
Post by islander
Post by El Castor
Post by islander
Post by El Castor
Post by islander
Post by El Castor
Post by Johnny
On Sun, 20 Sep 2020 13:35:20 -0700 (PDT)
Post by ***@mindspring.com
Post by Johnny
On Sat, 19 Sep 2020 16:09:24 -0700 (PDT)
On Saturday, September 19, 2020 at 4:48:02 PM UTC-6, Johnny
Post by Johnny
On Sat, 19 Sep 2020 15:42:51 -0700 (PDT)
Post by ***@mindspring.com
President Donald Trump stoked characteristic controversy when
he said Thursday he intends to create a commission to promote
“pro-American curriculum” in schools instead of what he
called "ideological poison."
It was the latest front in Trump's response to so-called
"cancel culture," which he has made central to his
re-election campaign and to his public appeals after
nationwide demonstrations against police misconduct and
injustice.
As he has before, on Thursday Trump decried "left-wing mobs"
and "Marxist doctrine," and he singled out a widely read
history of the country by Howard Zinn and a Pulitzer
Prize-winning project by The New York Times that re-examines
the role slavery played in America's development.
He also attacked "critical race theory" — which is much more
familiar in academia than grade schools.
"We must clear away the twisted web of lies in our schools
and classrooms and teach our children the magnificent truth
about our country," Trump said at the National Archives
Museum in Washington, D.C. "We want our sons and daughters to
know that they are the citizens of the most exceptional
nation in the history of the world."
What's your problem with what he said?
Lack of truth. You must like the Soviet way of teaching!
What's not true?
Well let us see! The founding of America involved the Genocide of
Indian Tribes. I was never taught this in school. The Trail of tears
was a forced march of Natives in winter to a place out west -
Oklahoma I would guess. I was never taught this in school. From 1846
to 1848, U.S. and Mexican troops fought against one another in the
Mexican-American War. Ultimately, it was a battle for land where
Mexico was fighting to keep what they thought was their property and
the U.S. desired to retain the disputed land of Texas and obtain more
of Mexico's northern lands. I was not taught this aspect of the war
in school
I think rather then mindless Patriotic Slogans, the children should
be taught a balanced reasonable view of history
When you are a child you are taught the basics, when you are old
enough to reason and think for yourself you figure out the rest.
We took this country by force from the American Indians and Mexico,
just accept it and get over it, or would you like for all of us to
leave and give it back?
BTW, who did those American Indians take it from? Everyhing got taken
by somebody from someone. That was the way of the world. Better to
worry about the here and now.
It is generally understood that there was no native population prior to
the last glacial maximum when migration occurred across the Beringia
land bridge. The American Indians did not take land from anyone.
They took it from each other, and the process was not nice. Look at
the rise and fall of the empires of South America. The native American
population was in a state of constant war -- with each other. Such was
the history of the planet. As I said, we should concern ourselves with
the here and now.
Thanks for the clarification. So, you are saying that we shouldn't
bother with teaching about the Indian wars, because that is not the here
and now.
No, it's history.
Post by islander
Are you saying that we should not teach about the Trail of
Tears? How about our Thanksgiving traditional stories about the
Pilgrims inviting the Indians to their Thanksgiving feast? If we are
only concerned with the here and now, perhaps you believe that the
Confederate memorials are meaningless and objections to taking them down
are unfounded because they are not about the here and now?
History.
Post by islander
Should we teach about the United Fruit Company and their abuses in South America?
How about the My Lai massacre?
History. The My Lai massacre was one of the reasons I resigned my
commission after my enlistment was up.
Post by islander
We learn from history and that includes learning about the bad parts as
well as the good parts, at least if we aspire to be a better nation.
My problem with the "history" to which you refer is that I suspect it
is being selectively taught, while context and inconvenient facts are
conveniently ignored by educators with a political axe to grind. So
teach history, but do it without an ulterior motive.
For instance, here is an interesting fact. At age 16 Sam Houston ran
away from home to live with the Cherokee for three years. A Cherokee
chief adopted him and he was given the name "Colonneh", Raven in the
Cherokee language. Houston had a good relationship with the Cherokee
for the rest of his life. That fact would be easily overlooked by a
teacher of history with a political axe to grind.
Ever eat a chicken, lamb chop, or hamburger? Some day you may be
regarded as a blood thirsty ignorant killer of sweet innocent animals.
You built a house on Orcas Island. Was that land stolen from the
original inhabitants, the Lummi tribe of the Salish people? Should you
return that stolen land under your house to its rightful owner? Or,
perhaps we should remember the past but deal with the here and now?
History has been selectively taught. If you have any delusions that
what Trump is talking about is not selective, especially regarding the
historical influence of slavery on the racism that we suffer today, then
you have been drinking the cool aid. We have a lot to learn from this
history and it is unfortunate that most of that history has been hidden.
Why not teach it, including the context and inconvenient facts without
making it political?
No problem with that ... if it is possible, which I very much doubt.
Post by islander
Was the intentional destruction of the Black Wall Street in Tulsa in
1921 by white mobs not history? That was only 100 years ago, but I
never heard about it until recently. Of course, the history courses
that I took in high school and college were taught in the south. Was it
covered in your history courses?
Nope, at least not that I can recall. Looked it up. Terrible thing,
but to put it into perspective, far more Whites are killed by Blacks
every year than died in that massacre. In fact, in the here and now
far more of every race (probably mostly Black) die every year in
Chicago than died in that massacre. Care to teach those statistics?
That does not excuse what happened in Tulsa, but neither can it be
used to justify crime and murder 100 years later in the here and now.
The number of people killed in the Greenwood Massacre in 1921 is
estimated to be about 300, all black. We will probably never know the
total deaths. Then there was the white mob that destroyed the town of
Wilmington, NC in 1898. Another victory for white supremacists!
Your examples of White misdeeds would seem more genuine and well
intentioned if they included mention of Black misdeeds -- as in far
more Whites killed by Blacks since that Greenwood Massacre. Are those
murders the act of Black supremacists? In all fairness, no. They are
the act of a race genetically deprived of the same level of
intelligence of competing White and Asian races, but forced by the
crime of slavery to live and compete with those races. Like it or not,
there is a proven inverse relationship between IQ and crime. Not
unexpectedly, US Asians who were the subject of great discrimination
in the past, have higher IQs than US Whites, and significantly lower
crime rates. The undergraduate student body at UC Berkeley is 35.4%
Asian and 2.3% Black. Discrimination -- no, IQ -- yes. BTW, 26.3%
White.
https://www.bing.com/search?q=Demographics+UC+Berkeley&qs=n&form=QBRE&sp=-1&pq=demographics+uc+berkeley&sc=7-24&sk=&cvid=5DFEC139B7994E76806DD71B751284D9
Post by islander
Chicago is more complicated, but there is no equivalence with the
Greenwood Massacre. There were 323 blacks killed over the past 365
days. About 1/4 of them were killed by whites. Sadly, murder is
concentrated in areas of poverty and high crime. The problem in Chicago
is not a massacre of innocents, but a legacy of discrimination over a
long period of time.
More accurately, the legacy of a population forced to exist in an
environment that evolution did not prepare them to inhabit.
I am very familiar with your argument relating to assertions of lower IQ
among blacks. You should also, by now, be familiar with my arguments as
to cause. Evidence is growing that many aspects of how well an
individual is prepared to function throughout their life is a product of
what happens during gestation. And, that is supported by evidence from
around the world.
As soon as you determine the exact nature of the environmental origin
of Ashkenazi and East Asian intelligence please share it with us and
the rest of the world. Forgive me if I don't hold my breath. In the
meantime, 85 median Black IQ.
Post by islander
I've also said it before many times in this forum and I will repeat it
once again for emphasis. Your justification for your argument is too
convenient in that you are attempting to justify your discrimination
with a flawed argument that genetics is immutable. I obviously disagree
and hold a more optimistic view.
You hold a very convenient and entirely political view.
Post by islander
If we are fortunate, we will see a resolution of this argument within
what is left of our lifetimes. In the interim, I choose a more more
optimistic approach to resolving problems of discrimination.
I also would choose a more optimistic, and dare I say, realistic
approach.
1. Quit importing immigrant Latino labor -- labor that fill jobs that
might be filled by African Americans, as well as others.
2. Retrieve manufacturing jobs from Asia -- jobs that could be filled
by African Americans, as well as others.
3. Devote legislative brain power to laws and a welfare system that
encourages, rather than discourages, two parent welfare recipient
families.
4. Continue, and expand, Trump's opportunity zones.
5. Quit punishing, and instead encourage, research on IQ and
techniques of genetic enhancement of IQ and other desirable
attributes, as well as elimination of genetic disorders and disease.
Oh, and by all means, throw in your gestation research
I would be most pleased to see my taxes raised to pay for all of the
above. Would you?
1. No. Latino labor is not the problem. In any case, I thought that
Mexico was going to pay for the wall!
Of course it's a large part of the problem. How can you possibly
contend that 11 million good hard working Latinos have not displaced
African Americans in our job market?
Post by islander
2. No. I find this condescending and racist.
Bringing back good manufacturing jobs to the United States, jobs that
can and will be filled by African Americans, is condescending and
racist?? Have you lost your mind?
Post by islander
3. No. That is a fig leaf intended to discourage public assistance for
single parents. No one should be enslaved in an abusive relationship.
African American two parent families have gone from 86% in 1940 to 26%
today. Black boys are being raised without the guidance and model of a
father. Who do those boys, raised fatherless in project housing, turn
to for male guidance? Gang leaders and drug dealers? Restore the Black
family!
Post by islander
4. Yes, opportunity zones have a long successful history, but cannot
seem to succeed in providing essential services in areas of poverty.
Food deserts are a failure of opportunity zones.
5. Yes, but it is the religious right that opposes genetic manipulation
in humans.
True, but far more importantly the liberal left, yourself included,
opposes any research on the genetic origin of intelligence.

Something you should take to heart ...

"Denying Genetics Isn’t Shutting Down Racism, It’s Fueling It"...
"Liberalism has never promised equality of outcomes, merely equality
of rights. It’s a procedural political philosophy rooted in means, not
a substantive one justified by achieving certain ends.That liberalism
is integral to our future as a free society — and it should not
falsely be made contingent on something that can be empirically
disproven. It must allow for the truth of genetics to be embraced,
while drawing the firmest of lines against any moral or political
abuse of it. When that classical liberalism is tarred as inherently
racist because it cannot guarantee equality of outcomes, and when
scientific research is under attack for revealing the fuller truth
about our world, we are in deep trouble."
https://nymag.com/intelligencer/2018/03/denying-genetics-isnt-shutting-down-racism-its-fueling-it.html
islander
2020-09-28 15:10:09 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by El Castor
Post by islander
Post by El Castor
Post by islander
Post by El Castor
Post by islander
Post by El Castor
Post by islander
Post by El Castor
Post by islander
Post by El Castor
Post by islander
Post by El Castor
Post by Johnny
On Sun, 20 Sep 2020 13:35:20 -0700 (PDT)
Post by ***@mindspring.com
Post by Johnny
On Sat, 19 Sep 2020 16:09:24 -0700 (PDT)
On Saturday, September 19, 2020 at 4:48:02 PM UTC-6, Johnny
Post by Johnny
On Sat, 19 Sep 2020 15:42:51 -0700 (PDT)
Post by ***@mindspring.com
President Donald Trump stoked characteristic controversy when
he said Thursday he intends to create a commission to promote
“pro-American curriculum” in schools instead of what he
called "ideological poison."
It was the latest front in Trump's response to so-called
"cancel culture," which he has made central to his
re-election campaign and to his public appeals after
nationwide demonstrations against police misconduct and
injustice.
As he has before, on Thursday Trump decried "left-wing mobs"
and "Marxist doctrine," and he singled out a widely read
history of the country by Howard Zinn and a Pulitzer
Prize-winning project by The New York Times that re-examines
the role slavery played in America's development.
He also attacked "critical race theory" — which is much more
familiar in academia than grade schools.
"We must clear away the twisted web of lies in our schools
and classrooms and teach our children the magnificent truth
about our country," Trump said at the National Archives
Museum in Washington, D.C. "We want our sons and daughters to
know that they are the citizens of the most exceptional
nation in the history of the world."
What's your problem with what he said?
Lack of truth. You must like the Soviet way of teaching!
What's not true?
Well let us see! The founding of America involved the Genocide of
Indian Tribes. I was never taught this in school. The Trail of tears
was a forced march of Natives in winter to a place out west -
Oklahoma I would guess. I was never taught this in school. From 1846
to 1848, U.S. and Mexican troops fought against one another in the
Mexican-American War. Ultimately, it was a battle for land where
Mexico was fighting to keep what they thought was their property and
the U.S. desired to retain the disputed land of Texas and obtain more
of Mexico's northern lands. I was not taught this aspect of the war
in school
I think rather then mindless Patriotic Slogans, the children should
be taught a balanced reasonable view of history
When you are a child you are taught the basics, when you are old
enough to reason and think for yourself you figure out the rest.
We took this country by force from the American Indians and Mexico,
just accept it and get over it, or would you like for all of us to
leave and give it back?
BTW, who did those American Indians take it from? Everyhing got taken
by somebody from someone. That was the way of the world. Better to
worry about the here and now.
It is generally understood that there was no native population prior to
the last glacial maximum when migration occurred across the Beringia
land bridge. The American Indians did not take land from anyone.
They took it from each other, and the process was not nice. Look at
the rise and fall of the empires of South America. The native American
population was in a state of constant war -- with each other. Such was
the history of the planet. As I said, we should concern ourselves with
the here and now.
Thanks for the clarification. So, you are saying that we shouldn't
bother with teaching about the Indian wars, because that is not the here
and now.
No, it's history.
Post by islander
Are you saying that we should not teach about the Trail of
Tears? How about our Thanksgiving traditional stories about the
Pilgrims inviting the Indians to their Thanksgiving feast? If we are
only concerned with the here and now, perhaps you believe that the
Confederate memorials are meaningless and objections to taking them down
are unfounded because they are not about the here and now?
History.
Post by islander
Should we teach about the United Fruit Company and their abuses in South America?
How about the My Lai massacre?
History. The My Lai massacre was one of the reasons I resigned my
commission after my enlistment was up.
Post by islander
We learn from history and that includes learning about the bad parts as
well as the good parts, at least if we aspire to be a better nation.
My problem with the "history" to which you refer is that I suspect it
is being selectively taught, while context and inconvenient facts are
conveniently ignored by educators with a political axe to grind. So
teach history, but do it without an ulterior motive.
For instance, here is an interesting fact. At age 16 Sam Houston ran
away from home to live with the Cherokee for three years. A Cherokee
chief adopted him and he was given the name "Colonneh", Raven in the
Cherokee language. Houston had a good relationship with the Cherokee
for the rest of his life. That fact would be easily overlooked by a
teacher of history with a political axe to grind.
Ever eat a chicken, lamb chop, or hamburger? Some day you may be
regarded as a blood thirsty ignorant killer of sweet innocent animals.
You built a house on Orcas Island. Was that land stolen from the
original inhabitants, the Lummi tribe of the Salish people? Should you
return that stolen land under your house to its rightful owner? Or,
perhaps we should remember the past but deal with the here and now?
History has been selectively taught. If you have any delusions that
what Trump is talking about is not selective, especially regarding the
historical influence of slavery on the racism that we suffer today, then
you have been drinking the cool aid. We have a lot to learn from this
history and it is unfortunate that most of that history has been hidden.
Why not teach it, including the context and inconvenient facts without
making it political?
No problem with that ... if it is possible, which I very much doubt.
Post by islander
Was the intentional destruction of the Black Wall Street in Tulsa in
1921 by white mobs not history? That was only 100 years ago, but I
never heard about it until recently. Of course, the history courses
that I took in high school and college were taught in the south. Was it
covered in your history courses?
Nope, at least not that I can recall. Looked it up. Terrible thing,
but to put it into perspective, far more Whites are killed by Blacks
every year than died in that massacre. In fact, in the here and now
far more of every race (probably mostly Black) die every year in
Chicago than died in that massacre. Care to teach those statistics?
That does not excuse what happened in Tulsa, but neither can it be
used to justify crime and murder 100 years later in the here and now.
The number of people killed in the Greenwood Massacre in 1921 is
estimated to be about 300, all black. We will probably never know the
total deaths. Then there was the white mob that destroyed the town of
Wilmington, NC in 1898. Another victory for white supremacists!
Your examples of White misdeeds would seem more genuine and well
intentioned if they included mention of Black misdeeds -- as in far
more Whites killed by Blacks since that Greenwood Massacre. Are those
murders the act of Black supremacists? In all fairness, no. They are
the act of a race genetically deprived of the same level of
intelligence of competing White and Asian races, but forced by the
crime of slavery to live and compete with those races. Like it or not,
there is a proven inverse relationship between IQ and crime. Not
unexpectedly, US Asians who were the subject of great discrimination
in the past, have higher IQs than US Whites, and significantly lower
crime rates. The undergraduate student body at UC Berkeley is 35.4%
Asian and 2.3% Black. Discrimination -- no, IQ -- yes. BTW, 26.3%
White.
https://www.bing.com/search?q=Demographics+UC+Berkeley&qs=n&form=QBRE&sp=-1&pq=demographics+uc+berkeley&sc=7-24&sk=&cvid=5DFEC139B7994E76806DD71B751284D9
Post by islander
Chicago is more complicated, but there is no equivalence with the
Greenwood Massacre. There were 323 blacks killed over the past 365
days. About 1/4 of them were killed by whites. Sadly, murder is
concentrated in areas of poverty and high crime. The problem in Chicago
is not a massacre of innocents, but a legacy of discrimination over a
long period of time.
More accurately, the legacy of a population forced to exist in an
environment that evolution did not prepare them to inhabit.
I am very familiar with your argument relating to assertions of lower IQ
among blacks. You should also, by now, be familiar with my arguments as
to cause. Evidence is growing that many aspects of how well an
individual is prepared to function throughout their life is a product of
what happens during gestation. And, that is supported by evidence from
around the world.
As soon as you determine the exact nature of the environmental origin
of Ashkenazi and East Asian intelligence please share it with us and
the rest of the world. Forgive me if I don't hold my breath. In the
meantime, 85 median Black IQ.
Post by islander
I've also said it before many times in this forum and I will repeat it
once again for emphasis. Your justification for your argument is too
convenient in that you are attempting to justify your discrimination
with a flawed argument that genetics is immutable. I obviously disagree
and hold a more optimistic view.
You hold a very convenient and entirely political view.
Post by islander
If we are fortunate, we will see a resolution of this argument within
what is left of our lifetimes. In the interim, I choose a more more
optimistic approach to resolving problems of discrimination.
I also would choose a more optimistic, and dare I say, realistic
approach.
1. Quit importing immigrant Latino labor -- labor that fill jobs that
might be filled by African Americans, as well as others.
2. Retrieve manufacturing jobs from Asia -- jobs that could be filled
by African Americans, as well as others.
3. Devote legislative brain power to laws and a welfare system that
encourages, rather than discourages, two parent welfare recipient
families.
4. Continue, and expand, Trump's opportunity zones.
5. Quit punishing, and instead encourage, research on IQ and
techniques of genetic enhancement of IQ and other desirable
attributes, as well as elimination of genetic disorders and disease.
Oh, and by all means, throw in your gestation research
I would be most pleased to see my taxes raised to pay for all of the
above. Would you?
1. No. Latino labor is not the problem. In any case, I thought that
Mexico was going to pay for the wall!
Of course it's a large part of the problem. How can you possibly
contend that 11 million good hard working Latinos have not displaced
African Americans in our job market?
You are making the same bad assumption over and over again, namely that
the labor market that these "good hard working Latinos" are filling is a
zero sum market. It is more complicated than that.
Post by El Castor
Post by islander
2. No. I find this condescending and racist.
Bringing back good manufacturing jobs to the United States, jobs that
can and will be filled by African Americans, is condescending and
racist?? Have you lost your mind?
Your implication, stated explicitly previously, is that manufacturing
jobs require little intelligence. That is condescending and racist. It
also seems to indicate that you are still thinking that manufacturing
jobs are what Henry Ford bragged about a century ago, namely that he
could replace any line worker with 30 minutes training. Those days are
gone forever and that is a good thing.
Post by El Castor
Post by islander
3. No. That is a fig leaf intended to discourage public assistance for
single parents. No one should be enslaved in an abusive relationship.
African American two parent families have gone from 86% in 1940 to 26%
today. Black boys are being raised without the guidance and model of a
father. Who do those boys, raised fatherless in project housing, turn
to for male guidance? Gang leaders and drug dealers? Restore the Black
family!
Are you saying that black women should be trapped in an abusive
relationship?
Post by El Castor
Post by islander
4. Yes, opportunity zones have a long successful history, but cannot
seem to succeed in providing essential services in areas of poverty.
Food deserts are a failure of opportunity zones.
5. Yes, but it is the religious right that opposes genetic manipulation
in humans.
True, but far more importantly the liberal left, yourself included,
opposes any research on the genetic origin of intelligence.
I do not oppose research into the origins of intelligence including
genetic research. Rather, I support more research into the human brain
including causal factors relating to intelligence.
Post by El Castor
Something you should take to heart ...
"Denying Genetics Isn’t Shutting Down Racism, It’s Fueling It"...
"Liberalism has never promised equality of outcomes, merely equality
of rights. It’s a procedural political philosophy rooted in means, not
a substantive one justified by achieving certain ends.That liberalism
is integral to our future as a free society — and it should not
falsely be made contingent on something that can be empirically
disproven. It must allow for the truth of genetics to be embraced,
while drawing the firmest of lines against any moral or political
abuse of it. When that classical liberalism is tarred as inherently
racist because it cannot guarantee equality of outcomes, and when
scientific research is under attack for revealing the fuller truth
about our world, we are in deep trouble."
https://nymag.com/intelligencer/2018/03/denying-genetics-isnt-shutting-down-racism-its-fueling-it.html
me
2020-09-23 17:25:28 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by islander
Post by El Castor
Post by Johnny
On Sun, 20 Sep 2020 13:35:20 -0700 (PDT)
Post by Johnny
On Sat, 19 Sep 2020 16:09:24 -0700 (PDT)
Post by Johnny
On Sat, 19 Sep 2020 15:42:51 -0700 (PDT)
Post by ***@mindspring.com
President Donald Trump stoked characteristic controversy when
he said Thursday he intends to create a commission to promote
“pro-American curriculum” in schools instead of what he
called "ideological poison."
It was the latest front in Trump's response to so-called
"cancel culture," which he has made central to his
re-election campaign and to his public appeals after
nationwide demonstrations against police misconduct and
injustice.
As he has before, on Thursday Trump decried "left-wing mobs"
and "Marxist doctrine," and he singled out a widely read
history of the country by Howard Zinn and a Pulitzer
Prize-winning project by The New York Times that re-examines
the role slavery played in America's development.
He also attacked "critical race theory" — which is much more
familiar in academia than grade schools.
"We must clear away the twisted web of lies in our schools
and classrooms and teach our children the magnificent truth
about our country," Trump said at the National Archives
Museum in Washington, D.C. "We want our sons and daughters to
know that they are the citizens of the most exceptional
nation in the history of the world."
What's your problem with what he said?
Lack of truth. You must like the Soviet way of teaching!
What's not true?
Well let us see! The founding of America involved the Genocide of
Indian Tribes. I was never taught this in school. The Trail of tears
was a forced march of Natives in winter to a place out west -
Oklahoma I would guess. I was never taught this in school. From 1846
to 1848, U.S. and Mexican troops fought against one another in the
Mexican-American War. Ultimately, it was a battle for land where
Mexico was fighting to keep what they thought was their property and
the U.S. desired to retain the disputed land of Texas and obtain more
of Mexico's northern lands. I was not taught this aspect of the war
in school
I think rather then mindless Patriotic Slogans, the children should
be taught a balanced reasonable view of history
When you are a child you are taught the basics, when you are old
enough to reason and think for yourself you figure out the rest.
We took this country by force from the American Indians and Mexico,
just accept it and get over it, or would you like for all of us to
leave and give it back?
BTW, who did those American Indians take it from? Everyhing got taken
by somebody from someone. That was the way of the world. Better to
worry about the here and now.
It is generally understood that there was no native population prior to
the last glacial maximum when migration occurred across the Beringia
land bridge. The American Indians did not take land from anyone.
Whose tribal land are you living on? Let your name be added to new history books as conquerer. Do the right thing - leave & return it to the natives.
wolfbat359a@mindspring.com
2020-09-22 21:54:33 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Johnny
On Sun, 20 Sep 2020 13:35:20 -0700 (PDT)
Post by Johnny
On Sat, 19 Sep 2020 16:09:24 -0700 (PDT)
Post by Johnny
On Sat, 19 Sep 2020 15:42:51 -0700 (PDT)
Post by ***@mindspring.com
President Donald Trump stoked characteristic controversy when
he said Thursday he intends to create a commission to promote
“pro-American curriculum” in schools instead of what he
called "ideological poison."
It was the latest front in Trump's response to so-called
"cancel culture," which he has made central to his
re-election campaign and to his public appeals after
nationwide demonstrations against police misconduct and
injustice.
As he has before, on Thursday Trump decried "left-wing mobs"
and "Marxist doctrine," and he singled out a widely read
history of the country by Howard Zinn and a Pulitzer
Prize-winning project by The New York Times that re-examines
the role slavery played in America's development.
He also attacked "critical race theory" — which is much more
familiar in academia than grade schools.
"We must clear away the twisted web of lies in our schools
and classrooms and teach our children the magnificent truth
about our country," Trump said at the National Archives
Museum in Washington, D.C. "We want our sons and daughters to
know that they are the citizens of the most exceptional
nation in the history of the world."
What's your problem with what he said?
Lack of truth. You must like the Soviet way of teaching!
What's not true?
Well let us see! The founding of America involved the Genocide of
Indian Tribes. I was never taught this in school. The Trail of tears
was a forced march of Natives in winter to a place out west -
Oklahoma I would guess. I was never taught this in school. From 1846
to 1848, U.S. and Mexican troops fought against one another in the
Mexican-American War. Ultimately, it was a battle for land where
Mexico was fighting to keep what they thought was their property and
the U.S. desired to retain the disputed land of Texas and obtain more
of Mexico's northern lands. I was not taught this aspect of the war
in school
I think rather then mindless Patriotic Slogans, the children should
be taught a balanced reasonable view of history
When you are a child you are taught the basics, when you are old
enough to reason and think for yourself you figure out the rest.
We took this country by force from the American Indians and Mexico,
just accept it and get over it, or would you like for all of us to
leave and give it back?
Then how come Trump supporters still act as though they have had just a grade school education
me
2020-09-23 17:29:41 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by ***@mindspring.com
https://www.yahoo.com/entertainment/trump-wants-pro-american-education-191725838.html
President Donald Trump stoked characteristic controversy when he said Thursday he intends to create a commission to promote “pro-American curriculum” in schools instead of what he called "ideological poison."
It was the latest front in Trump's response to so-called "cancel culture," which he has made central to his re-election campaign and to his public appeals after nationwide demonstrations against police misconduct and injustice.
As he has before, on Thursday Trump decried "left-wing mobs" and "Marxist doctrine," and he singled out a widely read history of the country by Howard Zinn and a Pulitzer Prize-winning project by The New York Times that re-examines the role slavery played in America's development.
He also attacked "critical race theory" — which is much more familiar in academia than grade schools.
Anti-American education would make so much more sense.
http://www.endit.info/PoliticalNarrative.shtml
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